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HG and Robotech Debates


azrael

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And y'know what... after all this time it's still bloody ridiculous... funny too..

I wonder who they're gonna go after next... HP's Atlantech? Robelwell202's "Destroid's Last Dance" fanfic? It seems like anyone who's running a Robotech project these days is now open to attack. I guess they're still targeting the UEG crowd because they actually managed to come close to putting something of marketable quality out there. Why can't they go after someone who deserves it, like Maverick, MEMO, or Doug Bendo?

They can't go after me because Atlantech is no longer an RT fan project, I recently cut those ties (which wasnt much) and started taking it in a completely original direction with its own origin and everything. Also all the designs and characters in it are 100% original and came from my imagination alone so again I'm in the clear.

But that still doesnt give them the right to stomp on RT fan projects which make their precious pile of poo TSC look bad.

Nothing at all... but let's be honest here, what do they care if the fans think they're jerks? The only fans they care about are the die-hards who'd buy Tommy Yune's bowel movements so long as they put "Robotech" and "Masterpiece Collection" on the box somewhere.

i loled

anywho I'm not surprised to see that I was right... memo defended HG yet again

wow, I hope HG doesnt decide to kill anyones family

*edit* So I heard Bendo is trying to come after me now?

Aww how cute, can't wait to see how he attempts this one ^_^

Edited by HappyPenguins
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And y'know what... after all this time it's still bloody ridiculous... funny too..

I wonder who they're gonna go after next... HP's Atlantech? Robelwell202's "Destroid's Last Dance" fanfic? It seems like anyone who's running a Robotech project these days is now open to attack. I guess they're still targeting the UEG crowd because they actually managed to come close to putting something of marketable quality out there. Why can't they go after someone who deserves it, like Maverick, MEMO, or Doug Bendo?

Oh, I very much doubt that RobotechX is in any danger of being shut down by Harmony Gold. After all, it's MEMO's baby, and he's one of the very worst ass-kissing Tommy Yune fanboys and goose-stepping pro-Harmony Gold fascists. You've got nothing to fear... your site's an unofficial police box for the Harmony Gold division of ThinkPol.

Speaking of... strange rumors have recently started reaching my ears concerning Harmony Gold's legal counsel and the cease and desist notice they sent concerning UEG's Robotech Genesis project. If what people are telling me is true (I'm still trying to verify it for myself, so it may not be), MEMO1DOMINION and several others have been telling people that I was the prime mover responsible for Harmony Gold's sudden urge to shut down the Genesis project. In the account that reached my ears eyes, they've been telling people that, for reasons that could best be described as "cartoonish villainy", I used my connections to Harmony Gold's legal counsel and/or senior management to get them to shut UEG's Genesis project down.

Now, this is so patently absurd that I'm hoping to high heaven that it's not true. If it is, then that just says something horrible about the whole Robotech fanbase and the deepening state of denial it's in. They can't debate with us like civilized folks, so they have to resort to demonizing us by making us out to be saturday morning cartoon show villains who just want to make the heroes suffer for no reason. The part I really don't get is that after spending all this time and effort trying to discredit my statements about the Macross licensing situation, they've supposedly done a 180 and are now telling people I have secret connections to HG's legal staff that I use to crush those who oppose me. If I really had THAT much clout, or any connections to Harmony Gold's senior management and legal counsel, I probably would've convinced them to hire someone competent to run the franchise by now, or just done away with the franchise altogether and gotten us some stateside Macross licensing.

I think I smell a libel lawsuit coming...

Hey, Seto... SICK BALLS!!! :angry:

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All this crap makes me think of the "Bad Boys" song from COPS tv show. The exception to HG, is that they seem to have this paranoia that everyone is out to get them. You know, cause Robotech SC is just ever so precious, it's one of those American classics that will last for-EVAH!!!

Aside from Nenad's own stuff that they took, which is more of a serious matter, this whole killing of their fanart just makes me laugh. It almost makes you wonder just how easy it'd be to torment them by doing, dare I say, drawings of Robotech mecha and characters?

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Well I hate to post yet again but it seems the idiocy keeps getting juicier...

I heard MEMO tried to blame Seto and me for the Deviantart fiasco

yeah we'd really go out of our ways to do something as low and shitty

because there's no way HG could be responsible!

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All this crap makes me think of the "Bad Boys" song from COPS tv show. The exception to HG, is that they seem to have this paranoia that everyone is out to get them. You know, cause Robotech SC is just ever so precious, it's one of those American classics that will last for-EVAH!!!

Aside from Nenad's own stuff that they took, which is more of a serious matter, this whole killing of their fanart just makes me laugh. It almost makes you wonder just how easy it'd be to torment them by doing, dare I say, drawings of Robotech mecha and characters?

My contribution:

post-939-1269964655_thumb.jpg

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it appears I now have a stalker

HappyPenguins I have to warn you this 'Doug Bendo has been asking about you on facebook this morning. I have him on my facebook and this morning he has been asking around on facebook if anybody has any 'personal info' about you. That just creeps me out. I don't even know if I want him on my facebook friend list anymore if he is asking for personal information about other people like that on facebook. I don't know the full extent of what you two got going against each other but be aware he is asking around about you on face book. And he seems creepy -autobotdan

Wow someone has some serious issues!

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They can't go after me because Atlantech is no longer an RT fan project, I recently cut those ties (which wasnt much) and started taking it in a completely original direction with its own origin and everything. Also all the designs and characters in it are 100% original and came from my imagination alone so again I'm in the clear.

Eh, never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers...

But that still doesnt give them the right to stomp on RT fan projects which make their precious pile of poo TSC look bad.

If they actually went after EVERY fan project with the potential to make their official products look bad, there wouldn't be any fan projects left. They just target the most visible ones that aren't already kissing their asses.

Well I hate to post yet again but it seems the idiocy keeps getting juicier...

I heard MEMO tried to blame Seto and me for the Deviantart fiasco

yeah we'd really go out of our ways to do something as low and shitty

because there's no way HG could be responsible!

No, what's REALLY funny is HOW MEMO's been telling UEG that we did it... reportedly he's been telling them that I "posed as Harmony Gold" and contacted DeviantArt to demand the removal of all of their Robotech Genesis fan works. The lies MEMO's telling are getting more and more extravagant and unbelievable as he attempts to undermine someone who just doesn't give a poo about Robotech anymore. :rolleyes:

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Agreed. SIGHUP, if I offended you in any way in the past, I am very sorry for what I said or did before. But I have to say that it's a crappy situation(s) your site has been put into by other people recently.

Oh no worries there.Technically its his site since he dishes out the dough for it. I just do the web stuff. Like it has been mentioned on this thread, RTX is probably in the clear since its not a company or anything and it is non-profit. The only difference between RTX and UEG's is the slightest possibility of UEG actually becoming a company. Correct, MEMO did not know the full details or maybe he did and way playing like he did not. Which is why Nenad and I discussed it to clear up anything and everything. No McKeever-style dodging, toungue-twisting, spidey web-spinning thiis one. :

Original discussion here

Is it possible that Deviant Art wants to remove all art just so they avoid conflict? Let's say without taking into consideration the type of art or genre it is? This way they don't get involved in legal troubles.

UEG: No. Acording to them:

The records associated with your account, robotechgenesis.deviantart.com/ indicate that the removed deviations were named specifically in a Claim of Copyright Infringement filed by Harmony Gold USA and were removed in order to comply with the claim of infringement on the federal trademark held by that company on the "Robotech" and "Macross" properties.

This is supported by the fact not all deviations were removed. 36 are removed. 18 are not.

Is UEG Productions a company or a fan group?

Along the entire life span of the genesis project (2004-2010) ueg was a RT fan group.(not a company)

UEG: Now it is just an Artist group...(still not a company)

There was mention in an article (sorry I can't get the link to it now but if someone has it link it please) and to my understanding, UEG was going to become a company with its base being in some islands somewhere. Clarification on that please.

UEG: Yes. The Kenna cubed article. The whole Genesis endevour made us realize our potential to create quality graphics and animation. However those plans for setting up a company were intentioned to take place long after the Genesis project is finished. (with original projects and IP) And had nothing to do with Genesis..

Nor there was ever any intention for Genesis to be used to promote that company...

...................................................

And as mentioned the true subject of this thread is in regards to UEG's own Cegar Project, which was removed and HG claims as infringement on their IP.

UEG: Indeed.

it appears I now have a stalker

Wow someone has some serious issues!

Not the first time eh lady?

My contribution:

post-939-1269964655_thumb.jpg

Me likey.

No, what's REALLY funny is HOW MEMO's been telling UEG that we did it... reportedly he's been telling them that I "posed as Harmony Gold" and contacted DeviantArt to demand the removal of all of their Robotech Genesis fan works. The lies MEMO's telling are getting more and more extravagant and unbelievable as he attempts to undermine someone who just doesn't give a poo about Robotech anymore. :rolleyes:

I'll have to ask MEMOEATS@DOMINOS on this one. See what he tells me.

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Well I hate to post yet again but it seems the idiocy keeps getting juicier...

I heard MEMO tried to blame Seto and me for the Deviantart fiasco

yeah we'd really go out of our ways to do something as low and shitty

because there's no way HG could be responsible!

How did that info come that he was saying that? That has got to be some of the dumb $hit I've heard in a long time. It's one thing starting a rumor that may sound half true, or be half true, but this is just strange science fiction. Almost better plot than Shadow Chronicles

My contribution:

post-939-1269964655_thumb.jpg

Dude, I am so telling on you. Why are you helping to destroy Robotech? :lol:

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Here's what I don't get: If HG is so uptight about Macross stuff and fan art inspired by RT, why haven't they done anything about all the RT videos uploaded by fans on YouTube?

RT is up on Youtube and Hulu for free (legaly) so I don't think they care at this point.

Has anyone seen this video?

The question about copyright comes up and they mention how they have merchandising rights but ignore the real question of whether or not they can produce future series with the original characters. The best part is that everyone cheers since they don't realize they've been given the runaround.

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RT is up on Youtube and Hulu for free (legally) so I don't think they care at this point.

Yes, I know about that, but I was talking about people posting Robotech II: The Sentinels on YouTube. They obviously posted the video without HG's permission. Also, on some of the more recent uploads, sections containing the Macross flashback have been taken down due to a copyright claim by the Bandai Channel.

Edited by areaseven
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How did that info come that he was saying that? That has got to be some of the dumb $hit I've heard in a long time. It's one thing starting a rumor that may sound half true, or be half true, but this is just strange science fiction. Almost better plot than Shadow Chronicles

Nenad told me about this himself, after he had a chat with memo

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Here's what I don't get: If HG is so uptight about Macross stuff and fan art inspired by RT, why haven't they done anything about all the RT videos uploaded by fans on YouTube?

Really, the reasons behind Harmony Gold's extreme reaction to the rather amateurish Robotech Genesis CG fan film project and not other, far more unambiguously detrimental fanworks is a complete mystery.

Of late, the only times when Harmony Gold has felt it necessary to trot out their legal counsel to start shooting cease and desist notices at people have been occasions when they feel the rights they obtained from Tatsunoko under license have been threatened or violated. It makes perfect sense for them to have gone after that MechWarrior game, since the developers were violating their rights and a pre-existing court settlement. I can see them looking the other way when it comes to YouTube, since the show is already out on YouTube AND Hulu. That said... there doesn't seem to be an obvious reason for them to go after UEG and their Robotech Genesis fan film. I can see two possible reasons for their actions, but since UEG Productions is determined to clam up we'll probably never know the real reason for this.

The more likely of the two possible explanations for Harmony Gold's sudden move to kill the Genesis project, which MEMO seems to have fixated on, is that they saw or otherwise heard about UEG's plans to eventually go commercial with their talent at some unspecified point in the future. The answer may be as simple as Harmony Gold not wanting a fan film based on their work associated with (and owned by) another company, and deciding to put a stop to it in order to prevent another MechWarrior-like situation or other legal complications from coming to pass, and didn't want to be arsed to hammer out some kind of deal with UEG either.

The other possible, though far less likely, explanation for Harmony Gold's completely over-the-top response to UEG's fan project is that they thought the project's status as a derivative work based on Super Dimension Fortress Macross (and maybe Southern Cross too) would draw unfavorable attention from Big West (and their lawyers) if they had officially supported the project like Nenad asked them to in his e-mail to Kevin McKeever. They might've seen it as a lawsuit waiting to happen if it was mistaken for something done with official sanction or support, and decided to protect their business interests by killing it before it could become an issue.

Of course, both of these are strictly theoretical, and assume that Harmony Gold is behaving in a rational fashion... which may not be the case.

Nenad told me about this himself, after he had a chat with memo

And I got it from one of the other folks he'd talked to.

Edited by Seto Kaiba
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RT is up on Youtube and Hulu for free (legaly) so I don't think they care at this point.

Has anyone seen this video?

The question about copyright comes up and they mention how they have merchandising rights but ignore the real question of whether or not they can produce future series with the original characters. The best part is that everyone cheers since they don't realize they've been given the runaround.

I think they know they've been given the runaround, but they just pretend that it isn't the runaround. To admit that, would mean that they've been wrong for a looonnnggg time. From where the video came from, and from seeing Maverick's post up there, it's a one-two punch of epic fail in getting anything right.

Nenad told me about this himself, after he had a chat with memo

Well, that anchors down the misinformation society pretty well. Knowing that as being a straight up lie throws everything they try to push with a bigger question mark (as if there wasn't one already). On top of that, having the angry little crackhead podcaster trying to find info on you is quite odd, too. Speaking of lil dougie, he tried to add me as a "friend" on Facebook. Then proceeds to talk crap about me. He must've gotten his feelings hurt by me not adding him. Seems like he gets mad cause he can't make friends, and has to take it out somewhere. Someone should ask him what it is that hurt him so bad, hahaha. Poor wounded lil guy. :wacko:

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The question about copyright comes up and they mention how they have merchandising rights but ignore the real question of whether or not they can produce future series with the original characters. The best part is that everyone cheers since they don't realize they've been given the runaround.

The user that uploaded that video was MEMO, notice the title and description. He believes that runaround is definitive proof of HG's authority.

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Really, the reasons behind Harmony Gold's extreme reaction to the rather amateurish Robotech Genesis CG fan film project and not other, far more unambiguously detrimental fanworks is a complete mystery.

Of late, the only times when Harmony Gold has felt it necessary to trot out their legal counsel to start shooting cease and desist notices at people have been occasions when they feel the rights they obtained from Tatsunoko under license have been threatened or violated. It makes perfect sense for them to have gone after that MechWarrior game, since the developers were violating their rights and a pre-existing court settlement. I can see them looking the other way when it comes to YouTube, since the show is already out on YouTube AND Hulu. That said... there doesn't seem to be an obvious reason for them to go after UEG and their Robotech Genesis fan film. I can see two possible reasons for their actions, but since UEG Productions is determined to clam up we'll probably never know the real reason for this.

Nenad actually explained what really happened on a podcast today, spanish podcast where memo was present, but then again he told me personally.

Anyway, what really happened was HG was trying to get UEG to submit Genesis to Robotech.com

because they are planning on having a section for fan films, and UEG was going to negotiate with them, but they wanted to have full control over the web series and HG pretty much said no, and gave them the option to either submit it or follow the order of the C&D. And there was also quite a few things suspicious with the C&D that nenad told me, he said it was dated back in september of 2009 and addressed to someone UEG wasnt even involved with yet..

He told me by that time Genesis was pretty much in hibernaton, and he didnt start work on it till later.

Now you see this confuses me and leaves me to believe that HG sent them the C&D in order to try and get UEG to submit to them so they could take over :wacko:

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The user that uploaded that video was MEMO, notice the title and description. He believes that runaround is definitive proof of HG's authority.

That makes no sense. The runaround is proof that they don't have as much authority as they would like everyone to believe, otherwise they would just put this topic to rest by saying "we can use any and all designs and characters for anything"

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That makes no sense. The runaround is proof that they don't have as much authority as they would like everyone to believe, otherwise they would just put this topic to rest by saying "we can use any and all designs and characters for anything"

Of course it doesn't, we're not the intended audience. It's supposed to be for those who can't or don't want to take the time to analyze its context for various reasons. For instance, its less important than getting to meet Carl Macek in the flesh, which is a big deal to some people, and getting another reminder that Harmony Gold will continue to commit to Robotech and maybe Macross in some capacity. They were vague about it, but that's probably enough to get people psyched for a couple of months about it.

Edited by Einherjar
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Nenad actually explained what really happened on a podcast today, spanish podcast where memo was present, but then again he told me personally.

Anyway, what really happened was HG was trying to get UEG to submit Genesis to Robotech.com

because they are planning on having a section for fan films, and UEG was going to negotiate with them, but they wanted to have full control over the web series and HG pretty much said no, and gave them the option to either submit it or follow the order of the C&D. And there was also quite a few things suspicious with the C&D that nenad told me, he said it was dated back in september of 2009 and addressed to someone UEG wasnt even involved with yet..

He told me by that time Genesis was pretty much in hibernaton, and he didnt start work on it till later.

Now you see this confuses me and leaves me to believe that HG sent them the C&D in order to try and get UEG to submit to them so they could take over :wacko:

That's our good ol' HG there, have fans do all the work, and HG will take the credit. Why do people even try to bother getting the blessings of the dysfunctional morons over there? Just like the "fan artbook" project. That guy, Brian McAfee has been trying to get HG to give him permission to do his book, but they've been giving him the runaround for sometime. Why even bother. If you're gonna do something as a labor of love, just do it. The second you get the company involved, it becomes a "how can we make this ours and make money off of it" ordeal.

If the C&D was written for someone who wasn't working on the project at the time, and not to Nenad or anyone else actually working on it, doesn't that kinda nullify the letter? I still think they should put it out like they had planned, as a free episode, and see what HG actually does. My guess, is that they wouldn't do a damn thing. Are they really going to fly to serbia for some court issue over a fan project? Something that isn't done by a company, but by a fan, as a fan project? I'm sure, proving the no money made, not sold, not done as a profit is easy to prove, even if they wanted to try to waste money on a lost cause.

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Nenad actually explained what really happened on a podcast today, spanish podcast where memo was present, but then again he told me personally.

I find it suspicious that this podcast, which MEMO is apparently a part of, was able to get a hold of someone from UEG in such short notice. And since I can't translate it at the moment, what was the intent of the host, MEMO, and Nenad for the entire show?

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I find it suspicious that this podcast, which MEMO is apparently a part of, was able to get a hold of someone from UEG in such short notice. And since I can't translate it at the moment, what was the intent of the host, MEMO, and Nenad for the entire show?

its actually JuanRT's podcast and he invited Nenad and memo too

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Concerning those people in the video cheering, most people don't really understand the situation. Many of these people are neither members of the RT or Macross communities. So what they read comes from Wikipedia or other sources. And it's only passing knowledge. Most of those people there don't understand how trademarks and copyrights work and how this pertains to Macross and RT. They just know that there is a legal situation. These people don't know that the rights have been settled for the past 5 years so any talk of the "original producers" still in litigation is not true. It is settle and has been settle for a while now. So while Tommy and HG are only addressing their side of things, these people aren't doing the research which spells out the complete situation. It stems from that many in that crowd do not quite understand how IP law works. From there, they don't understand how these things work out for RT and Macross. It would probably take a 2-hour seminar to explain to these people how intellectual property law works and then a 1-hour discussion of how this pertains to Macross and RT. I've watched some of those Youtube vids and most of the time, the question is vague enough that it can regard either trademarks or copyrights. How do we know what trademarks HG has? We looked it up. How do we know what copyrights are owned by BW? We looked it up. How do we know what BW gave up to Tatsunoko? We looked it up. How do we know how all this business with trademarks and copyrights work? We looked it up. It's all out there. All it would take is a some research. People just need to do the research.

In that video, Tommy let's slip that they want to take RT international so they can't use the designs in new productions or they would run into a problem with certain property owners.

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I agree azrael, that's the kind of people all that talk was for. The whole thing works on people's ignorance about a lot of things, especially about the entertainment that's available to them.

its actually JuanRT's podcast and he invited Nenad and memo too

So let me guess, Nenad was invited to defend UEG's situation from what HG did and MEMO, no idea, was invited to give people his views on why HG's was right to act? It feels too convenient.

Edited by Einherjar
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I agree azrael, that's the kind of people all that talk was for. The whole thing works on ignorance about a lot of things.

So let me guess, Nenad was invited to defend UEG's situation from what HG did and MEMO, no idea, was invited to give people his views on why HG's was right to act?

that's it in a nutshell

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I'd like to believe that when all this crap is said and done, disgruntled RT fans and even Macross fans still get the last laugh. HG can recite their spiel all they want in their lousy panels, but the truth will always hit them in the end. They can't fully exploit their most popular asset: the Macross license. They can take it out on the fans who hate their poo (the UEG guys being an example), but that's because they know they probably know they suck and they need Warner Brothers to bail them out. Yune's known to not take/handle criticism well, and its pretty damn sad he needs losers like MEMO to shield him from it.

Pardon my French, but HG can go suck it.

Edited by chrisk
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