HG and Robotech Debates

[Gubaba]

A response to this thread:

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?showtopic=31827

Heh. Memo put that video up at RT.com under the title, "WANNA TASTE OF WHAT THE RLAM WILL BE LIKE?" or something like that.

In other words, "look! Here's an amateur video with robots in it! Robotech has robots! So they're very, very similar! Isn't that amazing!?"

[HappyPenguins]

A response to this thread:

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?showtopic=31827

Heh. Memo put that video up at RT.com under the title, "WANNA TASTE OF WHAT THE RLAM WILL BE LIKE?" or something like that.

In other words, "look! Here's an amateur video with robots in it! Robotech has robots! So they're very, very similar! Isn't that amazing!?"

Those designs are atrocious... I hate the way they walk :|

if that's a taste of what the movie will be like then I'm swearing off RT for good

[Einherjar]

Heh. Memo put that video up at RT.com under the title, "WANNA TASTE OF WHAT THE RLAM WILL BE LIKE?" or something like that.

In other words, "look! Here's an amateur video with robots in it! Robotech has robots! So they're very, very similar! Isn't that amazing!?"

With Shadow Chronicles winning only a very independent film festival award since its release, it fits.

It reminds me of Supreme Commander.

[RDClip]

Those designs are atrocious... I hate the way they walk :|

if that's a taste of what the movie will be like then I'm swearing off RT for good

LOL, that would be the last straw?

[VFTF1]

Don't swear off RT for good. What would we have to laugh at without RT?

Pete

[Renato]

Is that Spanish-language release the three chapters of Robotech with the availability to watch them as the original series? If so, that'd be pretty cool.

From what I gather, you have to buy the separate Robotech DVDs, collect the enclosed coupons, send them off and then you can recieve the respoctive box set of the original series for free. They're not actually on sale, and there is no option to get them without going through Robotech first.

For example, it says you can exchange the coupons from DVDs 1 to 9 of Roboteck to get your SDF Macross box set.

Essentially, it's a case of "buy our messed up crap, lap it all up, and then we'll let you know what it's supposed to taste like".

[Jasonc]

Hmm, don't we hope it ends up looking like that. I wouldn't even bother. Just goes to show how RT fans are willing to accept anything. What can you do?

[Einherjar]

From what I gather, you have to buy the separate Robotech DVDs, collect the enclosed coupons, send them off and then you can recieve the respoctive box set of the original series for free. They're not actually on sale, and there is no option to get them without going through Robotech first.

For example, it says you can exchange the coupons from DVDs 1 to 9 of Roboteck to get your SDF Macross box set.

Essentially, it's a case of "buy our messed up crap, lap it all up, and then we'll let you know what it's supposed to taste like".

That sounds familiar. It's like the same deal Bandai had in the U.S. when they were selling individual DVDs for Vision of Escaflowne and Gundam Wing. If you collected the coupons from all the Escaflowne DVDs and turned them in, you got a replica of the tarot card deck from the show. If you collected 2-3 coupons from the Gundam Wing DVDs in succession and turn them in, you can get a model kit. I got the tarot card deck, but was pissed that I didn't get a response for any of the model kits they were offering.

This sounds like an incentive for curious people to buy the Robotech DVDs to get a huge bonus for their total purchase, perhaps with the hope that people will accept HG's version before the originals since it is the one being heavily advertised here. The originals are afterthoughts, but bonus afterthoughts.

[VFTF1]

but was pissed that I didn't get a response for any of the model kits they were offering.

Don't worry. IIRC the Bandai Europe/USA Gundam Wing 1/144 model kits were attrocities on sprues...if I may say so...

Pete

[Einherjar]

Don't worry. IIRC the Bandai Europe/USA Gundam Wing 1/144 model kits were attrocities on sprues...if I may say so...

I know, but at the prices they were selling them for, any freebies would have been welcomed. You just had to pay for postage. And there were no guarantees back then that they were going to eventually sell boxed sets. Now we know.

In fact, how old are those Robotech ads? I didn't know companies still sell individual DVDs for very old shows which have been released multiple times.

Edited December 2, 2009 by Einherjar

[Renato]

Wanzerfan claims that Buddy Holly's work "is a perfect example of bebop" (it isn't)...

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...mp;#entry806734

...because Buddy Holly sang "Be-Bop-a-Lula" (he didn't):

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...mp;#entry806761

Yeah, those are my favourite.

[HappyPenguins]

Don't swear off RT for good. What would we have to laugh at without RT?

Pete

but but, I am not bothered by your RT bashing!

and yes that would be the last straw...

[Lolicon]

Monthly cycles, childbirth, Robotech... truly women can endure far greater pains than us lowly men.

[Freiflug88]

Monthly cycles, childbirth, Robotech... truly women can endure far greater pains than us lowly men.

Believe it or not preventing the pain of monthly cycles and childbirth is actually easier then preventing the pain of Robotech for women, Lolicon. I have known a handful of women who became vegans and they all claimed that after avoiding meat completely they had zero pain and PMS during periods and the few that had children claimed to have had no pain during childbirth either.

[VFTF1]

My last two girlfriends would regularly attribute their bad moods to PMS. I'd cheer them up by saying:

"Nonesense sweetheart. I don't detect any change in your mood at all."

At first they thought I was being nice, but after actually thinking about what I said, they'd get really sore

Which brings me to .... women are super strong not only because they put up with PMS, childbirth and Robotech - but because they put up with guys too!

Pete

Edited December 2, 2009 by VFTF1

[Robelwell202]

My last two girlfriends would regularly attribute their bad moods to PMS. I'd cheer them up by saying:

"Nonesense sweetheart. I don't detect any change in your mood at all."

At first they thought I was being nice, but after actually thinking about what I said, they'd get really sore

Which brings me to .... women are super strong not only because they put up with PMS, childbirth and Robotech - but because they put up with guys too!

Pete

If I didn't know you any better, I'd accuse you of being a kiss-ass!

Unfortunately, you're right. There's no arguing the logc of the statements.

But... You're still a kiss-ass!

[Freiflug88]

Hey Pete!

Your man aren't you?

A man needs to be aggressive at times.

If you want a love girl, you must be prepared to go after her.

Don't worry so much about hurting her feelings.

If you really love her be aggressive! Make her your own!

So the next time your with a girl don't JUST remember love. REMEMBER to ask yourself "What the Fock Would Roy Do?!"

Unfortunately, you're right. There's no arguing the logc of the statements.

But... You're still a kiss-ass!

BAKAYAROU!!!!!

Your just as much a kiss-ass for agreeing with the logic *cough suck-up *cough "that women are super great just for being able to put up with Robotech and "guys" as well!"

Both you should have pride that your men and NEVER even consider labeling us men down to the level of that crappy series!!

[Einherjar]

Since he's probably going to see this eventually, I'll just leave it here because of the context (he'll know what I mean):

Seto, please stop feeding the sociopath, it's not worth it.

[VFTF1]

If you want a love girl, you must be prepared to go after her.

Roy's advise is only for blond guys. Going after girls doesn't work for dark haired guys. I have dark hair, like Hikaru. And like Hikaru, I never knew how to aggressively go after a girl - instead they'd just fight over me.

Pete

[HappyPenguins]

Hey Pete!

Your man aren't you?

A man needs to be aggressive at times.

If you want a love girl, you must be prepared to go after her.

Don't worry so much about hurting her feelings.

If you really love her be aggressive! Make her your own!

So the next time your with a girl don't JUST remember love. REMEMBER to ask yourself "What the Fock Would Roy Do?!"

BAKAYAROU!!!!!

Your just as much a kiss-ass for agreeing with the logic *cough suck-up *cough "that women are super great just for being able to put up with Robotech and "guys" as well!"

Both you should have pride that your men and NEVER even consider labeling us men down to the level of that crappy series!!

lol now now, some chicks are the aggressive ones and are just plain hard to get..

I know because that's how I was... how my boyfriend got me? I really don't know

but we've been together for four years now and have known each other for six or seven, but then again I'm nerdy and so is he

Since he's probably going to see this eventually, I'll just leave it here because of the context (he'll know what I mean):

Seto, please stop feeding the sociopath, it's not worth it.

It's not worth it, yes ,but it's mildly entertaining >_>

well it is for me anyways... but then again I'm a twisted individual

Edited December 3, 2009 by HappyPenguins

[Einherjar]

It's not worth it, yes ,but it's mildly entertaining >_>

well it is for me anyways... but then again I'm a twisted individual

The thing is, at least one influential person is going to let it keep going because of a personal agenda

mod

. But I guess both their credibility can continue to fall and no one would care.

Edited December 3, 2009 by Einherjar

[Freiflug88]

Roy's advise is only for blond guys. Going after girls doesn't work for dark haired guys. I have dark hair, like Hikaru. And like Hikaru, I never knew how to aggressively go after a girl - instead they'd just fight over me.

Pete

lol now now, some chicks are the aggressive ones and are just plain hard to get..

I know because that's how I was... how my boyfriend got me? I really don't know

but we've been together for four years now and have known each other for six or seven, but then again I'm nerdy and so is he

I just have to say that it just cracks me up how I emphasis "Don't worry so much about hurting her feelings" and you guys skip it and talk about the next line.

When Roy tells Hikaru "to be aggressive and make her your own" in my English fansub at least, I know full well he is purposely exagerating and going over the top and not supposed to be taken literally. Remember he is trying to hook up the Ice-cold Misa and timid Hikaru. Simply saying "I think you two would be great together" isn't going to work for this dense pair so of course he gives this over the top speech about what it means to really be a man and a women before making out with Claudia to try to get through to them while not being obvious and upfront about his intentions.

@VTF1: I believe your just sabotaging yourself with that kind of negative thinking and rationalizing. Love, attraction, romance whatever you want to call it is as instinctive as walking, eating, and breathing and its better if you just don't even think about it.

@HappyPenguins: That story just makes my day as I come from a Technical Insuitate where long term relationship between nerds are unfortunately few and far between.

@Einherjar: What can I say I love to let myself get carried away and be funny at times, but you do have a point that this topic is getting into personal off-topic stuff that should be wrapped up like NOW.

Edited December 3, 2009 by Freiflug88

[VFTF1]

I'm just happy that someone ELSE went off topic in a MW thread before I did for once!

So anyways...

When I played the Paladium Roll playing game, I didn't want to pilot a Veritech fighter because I was scared of flying and the whole thing just seemed fragile due to the jet mode.

Instead, I insisted on piloting a MK II Monster. I felt safe in one of those and would be the heavy artilery guy that would blow up the enemies AFTER they shot up all my team mates...

But one time, during a mission, I picked up a dead Zendradi and threw him at a nuclear warhead which blew up and - according to the dice - did minimal damage to me, but basically insinerated all my friends.

They were really pissed at me.

To this day, I don't know how a Monster can pick up ANYTHING - because it has no hands. But I did.

I also was really fond of the covers to the RPGs.

Pete

[Einherjar]

@Einherjar: What can I say I love to let myself get carried away and be funny at times, but you do have a point that this topic is getting into personal off-topic stuff that should be wrapped up like NOW.

Sorry for confusing you, I was talking about something on Robotechx.

[VFTF1]

Sorry for confusing you, I was talking about something on Robotechx.

Ooooo ! Trashy Robotech-gossip! Spill the beans - let us clueless folk in on it!

Pete

[Freiflug88]

Sorry for confusing you, I was talking about something on Robotechx.

WHAT! Your not considering me one of those Robotech sociopaths that Seto apparently feeds and keeps locked in his basement. How can I NOT feel insulted by that comment!

To this day, I don't know how a Monster can pick up ANYTHING - because it has no hands. But I did.

If its possible to fly a jet with a guitar then I believe its certainly possible for a Monster to just use the barrels of its gun arms to pick up the Zentradi corpse like a fork-lift then catapult it into the air.

Edited December 3, 2009 by Freiflug88

[azrael]

Need to get this thread back on track...

Well, it's said, no one was minding the store when M+ and MII came out. But as of now, HG owns the US and Europe trademark to "Macross". Anybody who attempts to bring any Macross over other than HG would be in violation of that trademark (and HG would win that outcome).

Animeigo had to work with HG so that's why there was no BS coming from them on that.

Read the License debate thread for more information.

In Canada prior use always negates trademarks; I'm sure it is the same in the US.

Yes, there is prior use in the US. But if HG released a product or service first, in other words using the trademark, then HG is the one who would win in the "prior use" case. In the United States, use of the mark is granted prior rights over registration. Most countries recognize registration first, use second.

[Seto Kaiba]

WHAT! Your not considering me one of those Robotech sociopaths that Seto apparently feeds and keeps locked in his basement. How can I NOT feel insulted by that comment!

Jeez, I stop paying attention to this thread for a little bit and the rumors of how cruel I am to Robotech fans get WAY out of control... For the last time, those are "alternative mulching supplies". I've just been dragging my heels about renting a wood chipper.

Speaking of Robotech sociopaths, I think I may have made dougbendo cry or something... he's devoted like half a dozen podcast episodes to trying (and generally failing) to badmouth or intimidate me, and he's spent the past two weeks or so trying (and failing) to convince everyone on RobotechX that Macross Frontier is child pornography and everyone who likes it is a pedophile because he believes, despite all evidence to the contrary, that Ranka is at most 12 years old, and that the last episode shows her "naked in space" for all of four seconds. He first got onto that tack when some people started criticizing RTSC and saying it compared unfavorably to Macross Frontier. I hear his podcasts are currently under investigation by TalkShoe's admins for a veritable grocery list of violations including (but not limited to) copyright violations, libel, threatening to assault other TalkShoe users and his girlfriend during shows, and the use of both sexually explicit and racist language in a show rated "All Audiences". Maybe that's why he's so pissy.

In related news, our mutual pal Pizza the Hutt got banned from RobotechX for the second time for repeatedly attacking an admin, and he's on his way to a second ban on Robotech.com for lashing out at anyone who criticizes the prospects of the Robotech live-action movie.

If its possible to fly a jet with a guitar then I believe its certainly possible for a Monster to just use the barrels of its gun arms to pick up the Zentradi corpse like a fork-lift then catapult it into the air.

I'd say if it's possible for a 11 meter tall Zentradi commander to ride a Monster into battle like a horse without adversely affecting it, then that's at least plausible.

Edited December 3, 2009 by Seto Kaiba

[Beltane70]

What makes PTH's possible second ban on RT.com is the fact that it's MEMO that's threatening to ban him.

Classic!

[D.D. Ivanov]

To this day, I don't know how a Monster can pick up ANYTHING - because it has no hands. But I did.

Well, in Ultimate Frontier, the Monster uses its stubby missile-launcher arms to sort of squish things in between them.

[VFTF1]

Macross Frontier is child pornography and everyone who likes it is a pedophile because he believes, despite all evidence to the contrary, that Ranka is at most 12 years old, and that the last episode shows her "naked in space" for all of four seconds.

I think that says more about Doug Bendo than about Macross Frontier.

Pete

[Gubaba]

I think that says more about Doug Bendo than about Macross Frontier.

Pete

No, no...it proves conclusively that anyone who likes Macross Frontier is a pedophile, pure and simple. Resistance is futile.

(Actually, the "discussion" got pretty funny after a while. Doug Bendo is a proponent of not believing official stats, but rather going ONLY by what is on-screen (which led to, yes, an argument about the length of the SDF-1), and about Ranka he said, "She looks twelve, so she is twelve," pure and simple. So Viper put up the screenshot showing her date of birth, which Doug discounted. When I asked him how he could justify believing everything on-screen, yet not believing THAT, he said, "Nobody cares about that anymore, it's history" or something like that. Then he went and made a two hour podcast about it. )

[Jasonc]

Jeez, I stop paying attention to this thread for a little bit and the rumors of how cruel I am to Robotech fans get WAY out of control... For the last time, those are "alternative mulching supplies". I've just been dragging my heels about renting a wood chipper.

Speaking of Robotech sociopaths, I think I may have made dougbendo cry or something... he's devoted like half a dozen podcast episodes to trying (and generally failing) to badmouth or intimidate me, and he's spent the past two weeks or so trying (and failing) to convince everyone on RobotechX that Macross Frontier is child pornography and everyone who likes it is a pedophile because he believes, despite all evidence to the contrary, that Ranka is at most 12 years old, and that the last episode shows her "naked in space" for all of four seconds. He first got onto that tack when some people started criticizing RTSC and saying it compared unfavorably to Macross Frontier. I hear his podcasts are currently under investigation by TalkShoe's admins for a veritable grocery list of violations including (but not limited to) copyright violations, libel, threatening to assault other TalkShoe users and his girlfriend during shows, and the use of both sexually explicit and racist language in a show rated "All Audiences". Maybe that's why he's so pissy.

In related news, our mutual pal Pizza the Hutt got banned from RobotechX for the second time for repeatedly attacking an admin, and he's on his way to a second ban on Robotech.com for lashing out at anyone who criticizes the prospects of the Robotech live-action movie.

These poor people with nothing to do except try to rationalize something that makes no sense, then try to substantiate it as to why an almost 30 year old series is better. What makes it even more funny is the fact that it's all done for a couple fans who actually care enough to keep up with it. I like keeping up with it for the sake of a good laugh, while I'm sure those in the other boat are really trying to be as serious as can be about all this. Some RT fan's very existence within the fandom just scream "run for your lives" when they talk, or "damaged goods". Thanks for providing the comic relief.

[VFTF1]

She looks twelve, so she is twelve

Doug Bendo must be very popular with women. "Hey - who cares if you're 40? You look 30, so you ARE 30!" They would love that line of reasoning...

But the thing is - I was never very good at guessing peoples' ages. It's actually not that easy. Besides, people keep getting my age wrong. When I was 23, people thought I was 35. Now, I still look the same pretty much, and people think I'm 30. So I guess I look "younger."

Who knows. And I could never guess any of my girlfriends ages either. I thought my ex-ex was 20 - she turned out to be 28. I thought my ex(?) was 28, she turned out to be 35... Whatever. Age has no meaning for me anyways.

Beyond that - who cares "how old" Ranka is? If Doug Bendo REALLY wants to argue the point - then my view is that what matters is how mature the person behaves and what the person does.

A 50 year old is capable of behaving like an immature jerk, or commiting theft, murder and rape, of being ignorant, mean and cruel. A 14 year old, meanwhile, could be a math whiz, very polite, helpful and full of positive energy.

Age is meaningless.

I think it's discrimination of young people and children to immediately say that if a girl like Ranka is sexy and smart then people who see that in her are pedophiles.

I mean - just what is Ranka supposed to look like and how is she supposed to act? Are all young people supposed to be wrapped in blankets and locked in their room until they turn 18?

And is it pedophilia to notice that a teenager looks good? Dresses nice? Is fun and smart?

Again - that's why I say that the statement shows more about Doug Bendo than about Macross Frontier. He just can't handle the concept that good looking smart young girls might exist and that to acknowledge it does not ipso-facto immediately mean you're a sexual predator.

Besides - that's also an incredibley narrow minded way of looking at Macross Frontier. I mean - nudity is not used randomly. There are contexts for it, just like there are contexts for the violence.

Oh - and of course I assume Doug Bendo (like most people who make this "eeww! pedophilia!" argument) has no problem with the violence. The violence is just fine and dandy. It's the love and sex that's bad. This is why Robotech is superior - it gets rid of all that pedophile stuff and just focuses on blowing people up.

Still - it's not surprising. What else can he argue? I mean - in order to prove that Robotech is better than Macross Frontier, you DO have to misrepresent the latter. You can't compare them on their merits, so you need to try to create the impression that Macross Frontier is child pornography.

After all - how many newbies who might also have a prejudice about Japanese anime being moe in general are going to check? They'll just hear Bendo say "it's another one of THOSE anime" and be like - "ewww!" and never consider it's made by the same guy who made Macross SDF...

But then again - sometimes I feel like the Western anime community is split into three parts:

1. The people who like hentai, and who enjoy the purely sexual aspects of moe, and who...I don't really understand - which is not a criticism - but I've encountered anime fans who are very different from me - in the sense that they don't collect mecha, and I'm not exactly sure WHAT they are fans of - or what they watch..but they just generally like "anime" - whatever that means. Vague - I know. I was kind of thinking "4-chan crowd" --- but that's not fair, since I've NEVER been to 4-chan ...maybe once...but it was very complicated to navigate...

2. Us. That is to say...I guess we are all old people who grew up in the 80s or earlier - I know some people on this board grew up in the 70s - and I like to think that since we've all been around, we have more discerning taste - although due to our NOT being Japanese (most of us) and NOT living in Japan (most of us) we are - no matter how hard we try - somehow outside of the norm in terms of serious Japanese otaku culture

3. The Robotech crowd -who harp constantly about bringing anime to America, but usually then go on to label most anime as pedophilia, and have no problem cheering on a live-action movie of their "anime" that will look like Transformers... meaning that they have nothing to do with anime except using the word sometimes.

Oh my - I've run my mouth off again

Incoherent babble ends!

Pete

[Einherjar]

It's not just any two hour podcast Gubaba, as described on the talkshoe page it's:

The Official Podcast Headquarters of the Robotech Universe! An Open "plain talk" discussion on Robotech topics such as the storylines, Harmony Gold, the original Japanese Macross, Southern Cross, Mospeada, Robotech.com and more!

The kicker, Memo supports him, so it's possibly true to them at least.

And to touch on something Zen72 talked about a while back on his show about the non-existence of a Robotech Gospel, a recent 12/2/09 topic on the Robotech 00 Podcast is, I kid you not:

I talk about what how not to look at robotech and how too look at robotech:)