Macross Frontier Final Episode Talkback Thread *READ 1st Post*

[Sulendil Ang]

Lunar: Why have you forsaken us?

I'm pretty sure Lunar haven't drop the series yet, although I admit I was a little bit worry when they haven't even release their subs for more than a week.

Where art thou, my beloved AVI?

[Mercurial Morpheus]

Nice choices Major Focker. There was a lot of good moments of fanboy pandering in this episode. One you omitted that I loved was Ranka returning the favor to Sheryl. Completing the circle by (literally) smacking some sense into her and reminding her just how vital she was in getting Ranka to her place.

A little rushed, but good ending.

[Sulendil Ang]

Lunar subs are out now.

[hikennoace]

You know the best part of this episode for me was when Ozma shouted "Totsugeki Love Heart!".

[Major Focker]

Nice choices Major Focker. There was a lot of good moments of fanboy pandering in this episode. One you omitted that I loved was Ranka returning the favor to Sheryl. Completing the circle by (literally) smacking some sense into her and reminding her just how vital she was in getting Ranka to her place.

A little rushed, but good ending.

thanks. the slap coming full circle wasn't lost on me. it was indeed a key point. but for some reason my PC just refused to screencap that scene. really... it was my PC's fault

[Spud387]

You know the best part of this episode for me was when Ozma shouted "Totsugeki Love Heart!".

Yes, Ozma is awesome because of his:

a) love for Fire Bomber

b) having the best looking VF-25 IMO

[Dio]

Wow, epic. Just epic. I was expecting something akin to Zero's bittersweet ending, but this was much better to end on a positive note (yes somewhat unresolved, but I don't mind all that much). I also loved Macross 7's ending for that very same reason - everything "big" got resolved, and left the smaller personal issues unresolved, but with a cast of characters who had finally perhaps grown enough as characters to finally address them in the Happily Ever After.

Moments I loved -

Vajra swarm shielding the fleet. That's one of those moments when you just KNOW the tide has turned.

Alto cutting the circle in the wall before rescuing Ranka really brought back the memory of Hikaru rescuing Misa after the Zentradi bombardment (though I've only seen it as Rick saving Lisa... all the same, it was a good scene).

Luca unleashing the Ghosts, talking about removing the chains that bound them, etc... that was a speech with a level of badassery on par with Samual L Jackson's Ezekiel 25:17.

Alto saying goodbye to his custom VF-25F... we were sad to see her go, but definitely appreciated her.

Here's an added bonus for me... the wife hasn't seen either Ep 24 OR 25 yet, so I get to re-watch them both this evening when she gets home from work

(Just can't let on that I watched them both early or she'll kill me)

[Strumvogel]

And Lunar's out.

This episode actually gets better with each viewing with me. So many great moments and scenes.

- Like when the Macross Quarter is streaming forward on it's rescue mission with it's entire compilation of VF-25's flying in squadron formation around it.

- The Varja shielding the colony ship from Grace's shot;

- The shot of Sheryl singing on the bridge while the Varja are flying escort replacing the lost ships and fighters;

- The aforementioned swarm of Varja forming a bubble shield around the colony ship;

- The Monster on a damn near suicide run to deliver the Battle Galaxy a face full of Reactionary shells, effectively blinding it and allowing the Quarter to get in close enough to deliver the famous and beloved Macross attack.

- The Macross attack itself and quickly followed up with the Battle Frontier delivering a punch so powerful it split the Galaxy in half.

- Just the shot of Alto's VF-25 holding Micheal's gunpod in one had and his own gunpod in the other while in Gerwalk mode

- While flying full tilt towards the Queen/Grace with Alto, Brera tackling another VF-27 before pushing it off and killing it with a shot

- The spinning burst of fire delivered by Alto and Brera

- The Varja flying up from the planet with Aimo being sung in the background

- And finally the shot of the colony, Battle Frontier and Quarter entering the atmosphere of the planet

Just love this episode.

Edited October 4, 2008 by Strumvogel

[DHX]

- The Macross attack itself and quickly followed up with the Battle Galaxy delivering a punch so powerful it split the Galaxy in half.

so the Macross Quarter's Macross attack was so awesome Battle galaxy punched itself in half?

Edited October 4, 2008 by DHX

[Xeros]

- The Macross attack itself and quickly followed up with the Battle Frontier delivering a punch so powerful it split the Galaxy in half.

so the Macross Quarter's Macross attack was so awesome Battle galaxy punched itself in half?

Fixed xD

[Strumvogel]

so the Macross Quarter's Macross attack was so awesome Battle galaxy punched itself in half?

Damn that would have been even more awesome! All avant garde and all that artsy thingime... things...

Fixed xD

Thanks, guess that's what happens when you try to type as fast as you can think.

[grss1982]

And Lunar's out.

snip......

Just love this episode.

You forgot Alto's "epileptic targeting" moment a.k.a Rapid Eye Targeting first performed by Roy Fokker in Macross Zero. IMHO, I laughed so hard watching that because he looks weird doing it. IIRC, he did the "epileptic targeting" MUCH FASTER than Roy or Ozma Lee.

[adrianop]

and he did it with a shattered visor

[Valkyrie22]

Ok..... great Finale episode. Soooo much to discuss... but alot has already been posted int he 50+ pages!!!

MY QUESTION!!!!!!! -

When Grace successfully accessed the power of the fold quartz capabilities to network the entire UNIVERSE via the Queen, we see her able to open up fold portals to Earth where we see the SDF-1.... but did anyone else notice the other location shown where they show another MACROSS ???!!!! Macross 11 (as translated in the version/download I had), but was that suppose to be Macross II (roman numeral 2) as in the SDF-2?? AS IN THE MEGAROAD??!!!!!

What the hell?? :blink: Maybe I was seeing things??

If not, what the heck is the Macross 11 (eleven)??

Someone slap me silly for seeing things to calm me down... or validate me in my wishful thinking!

[Strumvogel]

One thing that I wished that they had showed was how effective was Luca's Ghosts were with the Judah system unleashed. We didn't see any of the Galaxy's Ghosts get destroyed with the exception of the two that Alto took out in one single pass. All we saw was the Ghosts engaging and flying off in a frantic dogfight.

We could have had a more furious engagement spectacle surpassing Mac+'s Guld vs Ghost movie dogfight.

Well, maybe in the Frontier movie then....

[RedWolf]

Ok..... great Finale episode. Soooo much to discuss... but alot has already been posted int he 50+ pages!!!

MY QUESTION!!!!!!! -

When Grace successfully accessed the power of the fold quartz capabilities to network the entire UNIVERSE via the Queen, we see her able to open up fold portals to Earth where we see the SDF-1.... but did anyone else notice the other location shown where they show another MACROSS ???!!!! Macross 11 (as translated in the version/download I had), but was that suppose to be Macross II (roman numeral 2) as in the SDF-2?? AS IN THE MEGAROAD??!!!!!

What the hell?? :blink: Maybe I was seeing things??

If not, what the heck is the Macross 11 (eleven)??

Someone slap me silly for seeing things to calm me down... or validate me in my wishful thinking!

Macross 11 is both mentioned in Macross English Anticipation Manga and Macross Dynamite 7.

A copycat band named Fire Bomber American translated Fire Bomber's songs in English.

Managed by the most hated guy of the original Macross, Lynn Kaifun.

[Gin]

Macross 11 is both mentioned in Macross English Anticipation Manga and Macross Dynamite 7.

A copycat band named Fire Bomber American translated Fire Bomber's songs in English.

Managed by the most hated guy of the original Macross, Lynn Kaifun.

But I thought we all loved Kaifun.

[Valkyrie22]

Macross 11 is both mentioned in Macross English Anticipation Manga and Macross Dynamite 7.

A copycat band named Fire Bomber American translated Fire Bomber's songs in English.

Managed by the most hated guy of the original Macross, Lynn Kaifun.

Thanks for the reply to my question! It's been FOREVER since I've seen Mac7, and I've never read the manga.

I actually have the Fire Bomber English soundtrack and dare I say, I like it. :ph34r:

Of course, not as much as the original Japanese version.

So... it wasn't Macross II (2) "Megaroad". I wonder why they took the time to draw out (very detailed) an elusive Macross 11 versus the other colony fleets out there like Macross 7, or even flash a scene to Planet Eden!

Anyway. Still a great episode... a great entire series!

Sad it's over (for now)

Edited October 4, 2008 by Valkyrie22

[Shadow]

What a great finale! They put so much into this episode that it was hard to follow and no resolution in the love triangle. I think I would have liked to have seen an epilogue episode made though.

Some of my favorite scenes.

-Micronized Klan piloting Michel's VF-25.

-Seeing Macross Galaxy releasing all of those unmanned VF-27s and Ghosts.

-The Vajra shielding the main island from Galaxy's attack.

-The Daedalus attack on Macross Galaxy.

-Alto buzzing Ranka and Sheryl.

[grss1982]

snip......

* GG AVI by veffidas

@azrael & veffidas: Could you guys or anyone enlighten us on this video? What resolution is it? I'm asking because the Lunar subs video quality wasn't really good. There were also sync problems.

I'm downloading it now, but it still gonna take me a few hours with my slow connection.

Edited October 4, 2008 by grss1982

[adrianop]

I wonder why they took the time to draw out (very detailed) an elusive Macross 11 versus the other colony fleets out there like Macross 7, or even flash a scene to Planet Eden!

Some forumers mentioned that the location of Macross 11 is in the rim regions, so to illustrate the fold fault immunity of the Vajra network, Kaifun's fleet was shown.

Edited October 4, 2008 by adrianop

[Sulendil Ang]

I'm downloading it now, but it still gonna take me a few hours with my slow connection.

Don't complain, man: in my case, it takes almost a whole day, and the connection is so lousy, it keeps broke up during download. And without able to use download manager, I almost cry when that happens.

[grss1982]

Don't complain, man: in my case, it takes almost a whole day, and the connection is so lousy, it keeps broke up during download. And without able to use download manager, I almost cry when that happens.

Not really complaining, I'm just sad is all.

Anyways my connection suddenly improved and it looks like I only need 40 minutes more to complete downloading the *.avi version of GG's sub, which was done by veffidas. ;D

[Sulendil Ang]

Not really complaining, I'm just sad is all.

Anyways my connection suddenly improved and it looks like I only need 40 minutes more to complete downloading the *.avi version of GG's sub, which was done by veffidas. ;D

Wow, you're so lucky. Mine takes another 6 hours to complete, assuming nothing bad happens...

[grss1982]

Just finished downloading the "GG AVI" by veffidas. Thanks for the hard work man.

It's actually much better than the Lunar *.avi. and oh yeah to whoever is wondering its the same resolution as the Lunar *.avi (700x400).

Enjoy watching.

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

I just finished watching the end of the series:

Great end to a great series.

Would have been good if the vajra actually fought against each other just like the zentradi did in SDF:M. Oh well maybe they'll do a movie version where you have blue Vajra and red Vajra blowing each other up with their tail cannons?

So I suppose on the 50th anniversary we will probably see cultured Vajra with human pilots that sit inside the head of the monster? Ghosts will be obsolete since the vajra are pretty much superior at fighting? All the mecha will end up looking like something from aura battler dunbine.

Did anyone here feel like this series really tried hard to appeal to the fanboy of macross? Like they just tried to put as much stuff in from previous shows as they could? And because they knew people had seen previous series, they purposely twist things so you think something is going to happen and then something else happens just to say: "ha ha we tricked you!" You all know what I mean: the scaring us into thinking Ozuma is going to die, killing michel, the cannon fodder guy not dying when he should have died according to the DYRL style of cannon fodder death.

One thing I would like to have seen though is maybe Michel comes back from the dead and announces he fell in love with a vajra and they got married together, so that's why he went missing. But now he has space aids and must become a cyborg. Joking..joking

Edited October 4, 2008 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

Oh and on thing they never resolved was the idea that Alto was running away from something. I mean really that part of the story almost seemed useless to me.

I might change my mind on a rewatch of the series but can anyone tell me what the purpose of having this in the story was for?

Clearly Alto enjoyed flying. Yet you had this constant message that he is just running away. Michel constantly reminds him at the start. Now if they had removed these parts of the character from the show and put in more mecha porn (something like the destroid monster beating some bugs in robot mode for instance) would you have even noticed it gone? Would it have made much difference? I think that part of the story just went nowhere. "Please come home alto! Be nice to your dad and stop flying stupid valkyries and realise you are an actor not a pilot. Blah blah blah" ....but it got very little development.

I was thinking what was going to happen was his dad gets abducted by a vajra, he must use gerwalk mode to rescue him, and then his dad realises how important his role as a valk pilot was now that he was put in this situation where he didn't really like killing things or abandoning his dad but now there is little choice. Perhaps develop the dad a bit and show him do something like come to a realisation that you can't always get what you want. "You were right son! Your mother and I are proud no matter what you choose!" ...then maybe have him die suddenly from a stray bullet or something. (just like misa's dad died in SDF:M where he releases control over her and apologises)

Another thing:

I thought it was kinda funny when the bridge bunnies were all surprised about the ghost V9. lol You would think with brera stern and his futuristic brainwave controlled valk and cyborg body that those wouldn't really pose that much a threat.

Ghosts are seen getting pwned at the start of the series, so any impact that the revealing of the V-9 ghost would normally have, would now have been lessened at this point due to how the vajra themselves outclassed the drones in combat. Glad that the sniper weapon worked on them so efficiently.

This might sound kinda strange but I'm surprised that there was no mini "full barrier" used in the series. I'm thinking any mecha with some kind of full barrier would be a nice counter to a sniper beam on the first shot. So perhaps if they have a super vajra (evolved to deal with long range attackers a bit better) they could introduce that idea? (just like how humans adapted to the zentradi with the use of the strike cannon in DYRL which wasn't in the tv series)

Another idea is a type of vajra that just commits suicide (like a bee trying to sting something) and uses a pinpoint barrier ram attack at high speed. Seeing as how mindless they are, perhaps a kamikaze attack wouldn't seem so unreasonable after it was close to death anyway? I liked the idea that in the start of the series even after blowing its head off, it still continued to be a threat. That's got to scare the bejeezus out of people.

Edited October 4, 2008 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[grss1982]

snip.....

Another thing:

I thought it was kinda funny when the bridge bunnies were all surprised about the ghost V9. lol You would think with brera stern and his futuristic brainwave controlled valk and cyborg body that those wouldn't really pose that much a threat.

Ghosts are seen getting pwned at the start of the series, so any impact that the revealing of the V-9 ghost would normally have, would now have been lessened at this point due to how the vajra themselves outclassed the drones in combat. Glad that the sniper weapon worked on them so efficiently.

snip......

Keep in mind though that Frontier's Ghosts that were pwn3d back in episode 1 were "dumbed down" to the point that they had limited to no autonomous capability. They were used more like the present U.S. military "Predator" drones. That's why you had the scene in Episode 25 were Luca tells his three Ghosts that they are releasing them from their "yokes" in essence giving them autnomous capability to go head to head with Galaxy's V9 drones.

IMHO, Galaxy's V9 drones seem more agressive in combat than the dumbed to Ghosts of Frontier.

[MilSpex]

Pretty good ending to the series.

I just wish that little kid Luca had died a brutal death. He has got to be the most annoying character in the series. He`s an annoying precocious wimpy little kid that has no place in the series.

[RedWolf]

IMHO, Galaxy's V9 drones seem more agressive in combat than the dumbed to Ghosts of Frontier.

Well it is likely that the Ghosts are networked with Galaxy's cyborg/AI consciousness.

Where Luca's Ghosts are independent.

Basically the one versus many.

An autonomus AI versus a hive minded AI.

[Sumdumgai]

1/1 Lowviz Lurker, that cannon fodder guy did eventually bite it. He was still one of Alto's wingmen during the final battle, and one of the Ghost V9s shot him down after he starts screaming "Stooooooop!". At least I think that's Mr. "Get me and Autograph"

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

And about the red lobster:

It would have been good if they had one surprise upgrade path beyond red lobster stage. Sort of like what the inbit got in mospeada with the humanoid form.

Play with the idea that they are 'learning' like the humans can learn. But at the same time being more like us makes them more predictable too. (ie they are no longer alien and mysterious)

As an example with my mini-full barrier idea. They could have made it so the red lobster is able to create a weak full barrier that absorbs the first shot of any sniper gun. The first shot would reveal to the lobster what direction the shot came from and give it a chance to attack the sniper using a pinpoint barrier ramming attack. (the melee equivalent to the human's knife attack) The sniper then panics and can't focus and must run away to keep himself safe. But if you can take out the sniper the other lobsters can continue fighting so it's worth a suicide attack.

To adapt to this humans must have two snipers to deal with the upgrade in armor.

1. is the first shot that penetrates the full barrier.

2. is the second to penetrate the armor.

But the timing must be perfect. (almost simultaneous) So you could have the sniper dude in michel's blue valk for the first shot, and brera must follow up with an immediate second shot (he has faster reflexs so it makes sense to let him be the follow-up guy so the target has little window of opportunity to run) to finish it off to finally kill one of the upgraded red lobsters.

Red Lobsters would have no way to further adapt to this attack since it's just a matter of using more brute force over more newer technology. As the Zentradi had sheer force of numbers and humans had superior tech and the ability to repair in SDF:M, so the vajra would always be one step ahead of humans in weapons, (we would be to them like the zentradi were to us in space war I) but we would find countermeasures to their upgrades/evolved forms before it could take affect since all the damn bugs do is steal other people's ideas, making them easy to predict the more they fight against us.

I would just see the upgraded red lobster in the same way the brainwashed, mind-controlled zentradi had different clones that were stronger than others to maintain some order. Britai was bigger than other zentradi for example. So the vajra might 'experiment' from their experiences learning about humans and zentradi and try to have a special elite bug that sits somewhere between the queen and the grunt bugs in the chain of command.

Now because the lobsters never got an upgrade, some of what made them scary in the beginning of the series was lost towards the end. The inbit got an upgrade. (human form) Humans got an upgrade. (strike cannon, FAST pack, GBP armor) But the vajra didn't. Where's their "FAST pack" and long range sensor to deal with snipers trying to hurt them from a concealed location?

"But the zentradi never got an upgrade in SDF:M!"

Yes they did: the upgrade towards the end of SDF:M was them 'learning' about culture but then using that education to repair things to use against us in the form of kamjin repairing the crashed ship for one final attack on the SDF-1. You couldn't say the zentradi were dumb anymore after exposure to humans and learning about themselves more. Now they were a bit more smart, and could use the repairing knowledge to fix their own equipment. Of course now they didn't have as large numbers, but they could adapt a bit. Learn from watching humans.

Edited October 4, 2008 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Morpheus]

Did Sheryl imitates Minmay dance when she sing "My boyfriend is a pilot"?

[dreamweaver13]

Did Sheryl imitates Minmay dance when she sing "My boyfriend is a pilot"?

have to watch it again to be sure.

actually, here's a thought: did all the key girls in macross triangles sing "my boyfriend is a pilot?"

obviously, Minmay did.

Myung did.

can't remember if Mylene did.

Ranka did in the Ms. Macross competition.

And Sheryl found a way to sneak it into her medley.

is this song the standard piece that everyone has to sing at one point or another?

EDIT: OOPS. i forgot. it wasn't Myung who sang it. oh well, that strikes this theory down the drain.

So anyway, let's take this train of thought into another direction. so, why did Sheryl just have to sneak "my boyfriend is a pilot" into her medley?

well.... the answer is quite obvious, if you take the exact timing into consideration. Sheryl sneaked it in at the exact same time that ranka was all-happy about being rescued by Alto.

so basically, it was a message to Ranka that Alto is her boyfriend. sure, i'm helping him rescue you, but here's the real deal... "watashi no kare wa pilot". y'know, just so there's no misunderstanding, ok?.

Edited October 6, 2008 by dreamweaver13

[dreamweaver13]

Would have been good if the vajra actually fought against each other just like the zentradi did in SDF:M. Oh well maybe they'll do a movie version where you have blue Vajra and red Vajra blowing each other up with their tail cannons?

but they did, didn't they?

the vajra converted by ranka's song vs. the possessed mother queen and her remaining minions.

in fact, if you recall, the queen fired a motherblast against City 1, but it was blocked by the red-tinged Vajra.