d3v Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 Indeed, although you have to account for people who are just born on colony ships. Alto I think came from Earth or Eden though (or many another planet colony we don't know about) as the flashbacks don't look under a dome. Got me thinking, maybe one of the reasons why Alto is the way he is is that he was born on a planet, then they moved to the Frontier but had to leave his mother behind, and that his love of flying was partly due to his mother for some reason or other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Dex Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 Very likely I believe. The flashback still showed him throwing paper airplanes and it didn't look like a dome. Having a love for flying and then moving onto a ship with a 2000 ft sky limit. It is like being a regular beach goer that moves to Alaska, or a city person that moves to a farm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beltane70 Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 Very likely I believe. The flashback still showed him throwing paper airplanes and it didn't look like a dome. Having a love for flying and then moving onto a ship with a 2000 ft sky limit. It is like being a regular beach goer that moves to Alaska, or a city person that moves to a farm. The flashback actually was on a colony ship. The dome details are there, just very faintly. If you have a low-quality version of the episode, the details are pretty easy to miss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Dex Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 I actually had an HD raw (used an .ass file for subs) so I guess missed it (will go back to see it), but it looked like a real sky. Still that doesn't mean Alto wasn't born planet-side, and it makes sense for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clay Cliff Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 (edited) What do you think about this book?: That's it... Many thanks in advance. Regards. Edited June 22, 2008 by Clay Cliff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 What do you think about this book?: That's it... Many thanks in advance. Regards. Why should you care what we think when you can check it out for yourself at macrosshare? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zinjo Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 What do you think about this book?: That's it... Many thanks in advance. Regards. All the information you would want to know is in the book section of this site. http://www.macrossworld.com/macross/books/dou_mat3extra.htm I like it, however without fluent Japanese under my belt, I don't get as much out of it as a Japanese fan would... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamweaver13 Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 The flashback actually was on a colony ship. The dome details are there, just very faintly. If you have a low-quality version of the episode, the details are pretty easy to miss. hmm... that would be weird. that means the frontier has been travelling that long (17 years?) already. on the other hand, if it's a different colony fleet, do citizens actually jump from one to the other? i always thought that a citizen of one fleet stays there until the fleet finds a habitable planet. on the other hand, since the saotome name is very popular in entertainment, i would also understand if the family travels between fleets every number of years... mother left behind? or already dead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DestroidDefender Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 The Paper plane flashback was on a colony ship - I remember noticing specifically the faint white line grid in the sky. Alto's family probably came aboard MacF for the launch when he was very young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamweaver13 Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 The Paper plane flashback was on a colony ship - I remember noticing specifically the faint white line grid in the sky. Alto's family probably came aboard MacF for the launch when he was very young. ok. so now i see how the dialogue between alto and his mom went in that flashback: alto: mom! look, i'm gonna launch my plane now. see it go. Kyuuuuun!!! mom: that's nice dear. alto:..... alto:.... mom, my plane doesn't seem to be moving like it usually does. what's wrong? mom: oh dear, that's not the real sky anymore. we're in a spaceship now, and that's just a fake sky. alto: fake... sky?...... NNNNNnnnoooooooooo!! mom: oh cut that out, you're such a drama queen... dad saotome: that was perfect!! he'll play the princess!! and that was how the legend of alto-hime the actress began... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d3v Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 (edited) ok. so now i see how the dialogue between alto and his mom went in that flashback: alto: mom! look, i'm gonna launch my plane now. see it go. Kyuuuuun!!! mom: that's nice dear. alto:..... alto:.... mom, my plane doesn't seem to be moving like it usually does. what's wrong? mom: oh dear, that's not the real sky anymore. we're in a spaceship now, and that's just a fake sky. alto: fake... sky?...... NNNNNnnnoooooooooo!! mom: oh cut that out, you're such a drama queen... dad saotome: that was perfect!! he'll play the princess!! and that was how the legend of alto-hime the actress began... So all Ranzo really wants is for Alto to become a well known crossdresser, just like him. Edited June 23, 2008 by d3v Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zinjo Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 So all Ranzo really wants is for Alto to become a well known crossdresser, just like him. OK kids, the episode 11 discussion is spilling over into the newbie thread. Could we take the remainder of it back where it belongs? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamweaver13 Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 OK kids, the episode 11 discussion is spilling over into the newbie thread. Could we take the remainder of it back where it belongs? Thanks oops. good point. sorry bout that. now what was the question again...right... so any idea about the citizen selection system? i take it that there is no official word yet on this matter? it could make for an interesting short story or oav, if some people actually want to stay on earth, or want to move to another fleet. oh well. moving on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifbeat Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Back to this book: http://www.macrossworld.com/macross/books/dou_mat3extra.htm First time I've seen it. What's the deal? Those look like REAL pictures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Back to this book: http://www.macrossworld.com/macross/books/dou_mat3extra.htm First time I've seen it. What's the deal? Those look like REAL pictures. Again, you can download it at macrosshare... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zinjo Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Again, you can download it at macrosshare... They are asking about the book, not where to download it... Hence why the question is in the "newbie" thread... fifbeat: If you follow the link I provided it gives you an explanation of what's in the book and why it looks the way it does... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 They are asking about the book, not where to download it... In the words of a certain imprudent test pilot, "A real trip is worth more than a thousand travel books." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulendil Ang Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 Another question from me: Does VF-4 has any FAST Pack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr March Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 There might have been if we saw more of the VF-4. There's some art from the Macross Graffiti book which shows concept drawings of the VF-4 fighter mode with FAST Packs. But that's about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulendil Ang Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 I'm wondering, does the vernier thruster of the variable fighters requires fuel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr March Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 (edited) I believe so. Given the position of the verniers, there'd be no way to use the main engine thrust, so they'd have to be self-contained thrusters with their own propellant. Edited June 25, 2008 by Mr March Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLoneWolf Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 Another question from me: Does VF-4 has any FAST Pack? According to Macross canon: no However, in the non-canon game, Eternal Love Song, we do see FAST Pack equipped VF-4's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d3v Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 According to Macross canon: no However, in the non-canon game, Eternal Love Song, we do see FAST Pack equipped VF-4's. Of course even the battroid mode shown there is non-canon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB0 Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 I'm wondering, does the vernier thruster of the variable fighters requires fuel? I believe so. Given the position of the verniers, there'd be no way to use the main engine thrust, so they'd have to be self-contained thrusters with their own propellant. And even if they DID have access to the main engine's reaction mass, that doesn't mean they don't need fuel, just that they don't have a dedicated tank. It would be, shall we say, difficult to produce thrust without some kind of mass to eject. As Macross stays on the more "realistic" side of sci-fi, I think it's safe to assume they haven't figured out a way around the laws of motion yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Dex Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 Not many science fiction show get away with moving at sub-light speeds without ejecting some reaction mass, even Star Trek's impulse drives eject plasma from nuclear fusion reactions (regardless of whether it uses driver coils to lighten the ships mass in the process). Point is only when FTL is brought is does pseudo science come into play the most. I assume the vernier thrusters and any other RCS thrusters use their own fuel supply, and most likely are traditional chemical burning thrusters as they don't use a lot of fuel anyway for moving so it wouldn't hurt. Besides having thermonuclear reactors for each little thruster seems pushing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamweaver13 Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 Not many science fiction show get away with moving at sub-light speeds without ejecting some reaction mass, even Star Trek's impulse drives eject plasma from nuclear fusion reactions (regardless of whether it uses driver coils to lighten the ships mass in the process). Point is only when FTL is brought is does pseudo science come into play the most. I assume the vernier thrusters and any other RCS thrusters use their own fuel supply, and most likely are traditional chemical burning thrusters as they don't use a lot of fuel anyway for moving so it wouldn't hurt. Besides having thermonuclear reactors for each little thruster seems pushing it. on the other hand, wouldn't that nevertheless limit the operating time of a valkyrie, if it needs fuel for the vernier thrusters? i don't recall any series where refueling became an issue (other than 0, of course). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Dex Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 Like I said, verniers aren't something used extensively, they are for changing attitude. Also even with the reaction engines for space flight they will eventually have to refuel their on board propellant. They just don't talk about it in the show. In atmosphere where on board propellant isn't needed for the main engines, you don't need verniers because your are in an atmosphere and there they fly the traditional way, with wings and manipulation of air flow across them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulendil Ang Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 Like I said, verniers aren't something used extensively, they are for changing attitude. Also even with the reaction engines for space flight they will eventually have to refuel their on board propellant. They just don't talk about it in the show. In atmosphere where on board propellant isn't needed for the main engines, you don't need verniers because your are in an atmosphere and there they fly the traditional way, with wings and manipulation of air flow across them. This is the first time I heard that thermonuclear engines still needs propellant in space. Can anyone else confirm that fact? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d3v Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 This is the first time I heard that thermonuclear engines still needs propellant in space. Can anyone else confirm that fact? To put it simply, the engines reactors simply provide the intense heat needed to convert the propellant into plasma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr March Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 I think we've been over this several times before. The way the reaction engines are described on the compendium, it's specifically stated that some kind of reactant is required to operate. So some type of mass is being expelled out of the engine to provide thrust. But given that Valkyries are very small mass vehicles, they would be extremely efficient. Likely they require very little reactant mass to function. Indeed, the VF-1 weighs 13.25 tons empty and only 5.25 tons extra mass is added in the standard take-off configuration for fuel, weapons and ammo. OverTechnology is wonderful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d3v Posted June 26, 2008 Share Posted June 26, 2008 According to Macross canon: no However, in the non-canon game, Eternal Love Song, we do see FAST Pack equipped VF-4's. Actually, I just remembered there was some VF-4 w/ FAST Pack line art posted in one of threads in the Toy sections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB0 Posted June 26, 2008 Share Posted June 26, 2008 Not many science fiction show get away with moving at sub-light speeds without ejecting some reaction mass, even Star Trek's impulse drives eject plasma from nuclear fusion reactions (regardless of whether it uses driver coils to lighten the ships mass in the process). Point is only when FTL is brought is does pseudo science come into play the most. On the other hand... not many sci-fi shows DON'T have inertial dampers. Hooray Macross! I assume the vernier thrusters and any other RCS thrusters use their own fuel supply, and most likely are traditional chemical burning thrusters as they don't use a lot of fuel anyway for moving so it wouldn't hurt. Besides having thermonuclear reactors for each little thruster seems pushing it. I was always under the impression that there was just ONE fusion reactor, and heat was transferred away from it to the engines' "combustion" chambers. Either way, I agree the thrusters probably function more traditionally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azrael Posted June 26, 2008 Author Share Posted June 26, 2008 Actually, I just remembered there was some VF-4 w/ FAST Pack line art posted in one of threads in the Toy sections. Although, those are based on the pre-final drawings. Notice the VF-4 is missing the arm blocks and the tail fins are pushed out farther toward the wing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Dex Posted June 26, 2008 Share Posted June 26, 2008 On the other hand... not many sci-fi shows DON'T have inertial dampers. Hooray Macross! I was always under the impression that there was just ONE fusion reactor, and heat was transferred away from it to the engines' "combustion" chambers. Either way, I agree the thrusters probably function more traditionally. Heh true, never noticed the lack of inertial damper mentions. I guess then Macross ships either don't accelerate too fast or they use the same systems that make artificial gravity to counteract inertia (which is a form of theoretical inertial damper) and they just don't talk about it or refer to it as such. Well while that is a possibility and certainly could be how it works, given the way everything is set up on a Valkyrie I think it makes most sense to assume that there is one fusion reactor per main engine and it is in the leg/engine piece. Although I don't really know what an Overtechnology fusion reactor would look like, I assume it isn't tiny so it just seems to me the logical place to put it is in the engine and there is two of those so I guess each have one and they combine to generate the total power of the valkyrie. I don't know where else the reactor/s could be on the valk to tell the truth, so it just makes sense to me to believe one in each leg. Now I can believe the main battery that the fusion reactor powers might be elsewhere (there probably is a battery that the reactor charges that can be used for things on the plane when the engines aren't active, like how a car battery is used almost). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d3v Posted June 26, 2008 Share Posted June 26, 2008 Although, those are based on the pre-final drawings. Notice the VF-4 is missing the arm blocks and the tail fins are pushed out farther toward the wing. Ah yes, didn't notice those. Still it's nice to speculate on what a set of FAST packs for the VF-4 would have looked like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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