sucker4meltrans Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 protodevlin and now vajra what else of the protoculture legacy is at the galactic center that awaits to destroy NUN Spacy fleets?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWolf Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 protodevlin and now vajra what else of the protoculture legacy is at the galactic center that awaits to destroy NUN Spacy fleets?? Supervision Army or the Protoculture themselves armed with Birdmen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kronnang Dunn Posted July 24, 2008 Author Share Posted July 24, 2008 Supervision Army or the Protoculture themselves armed with Birdmen. Whoa... Just imagine an entire fleet of Birdmen... Holy be-jeezus!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWolf Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 Whoa... Just imagine an entire fleet of Birdmen... Holy be-jeezus!!! I believe the term is Yakh Deculture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 protodevlin and now vajra what else of the protoculture legacy is at the galactic center that awaits to destroy NUN Spacy fleets?? Ehem....Megaroad 1 with mass produced full armored VF-4 piloted by Minmay clones.....(ok, the heat is getting into my brain...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWolf Posted July 25, 2008 Share Posted July 25, 2008 I'll have to wait for the translation but I'm beginning to see the motivations behind Grace et al and Bilrer. Bilrer said his dream is to make the galaxy a smaller place using Fold Quartz. Like the new LAI booster and instant communication. Bringing the children of the Protoculture together. Now what did the Protoculture could not achive in their 500,000 years of history? Unity and Peace. In Macross Plus and VFX-2 there are still colony disputes, rogue Zentradi, worst a coup attempt. Humanity is mearely taking the same footsteps as the failed Stellar Republic. As Linderman in the show Heroes said to Nathan. People need hope but it is fear they trust fear. This tragedy will rally the people in a united sense of hope under united sense of fear. Macross Galaxy is using the Vajra to create fear and establish themselves to guide civilization. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted July 25, 2008 Share Posted July 25, 2008 I'll have to wait for the translation but I'm beginning to see the motivations behind Grace et al and Bilrer. Bilrer said his dream is to make the galaxy a smaller place using Fold Quartz. Like the new LAI booster and instant communication. Bringing the children of the Protoculture together. Now what did the Protoculture could not achive in their 500,000 years of history? Unity and Peace. In Macross Plus and VFX-2 there are still colony disputes, rogue Zentradi, worst a coup attempt. Humanity is mearely taking the same footsteps as the failed Stellar Republic. As Linderman in the show Heroes said to Nathan. People need hope but it is fear they trust fear. This tragedy will rally the people in a united sense of hope under united sense of fear. Macross Galaxy is using the Vajra to create fear and establish themselves to guide civilization. In other word in order to make a harmony civilization, they must assimilated human/zentreadi into one collective just like what Galaxy did. "Resistance is futile". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kronnang Dunn Posted July 25, 2008 Author Share Posted July 25, 2008 In other word in order to make a harmony civilization, they must assimilated human/zentreadi into one collective just like what Galaxy did. "Resistance is futile". Indeed... I believe all the cyborgs from Galaxy are mindless zombies by now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s-girl Posted July 26, 2008 Share Posted July 26, 2008 watching 16 with the subs and watching Sheryl (watching Ranka) makes me think that the reason for two songstresses may be that neither is completely wholly able to function on their own at this point. Ranka is emotionally scarred due to her past history and Sheryl healthwise seems to be a bit uncertain. I guess I'm going to speculate that at some point we'll see both of them in battle singing together for those reasons and possibly because waves do better when they resonate. Their amplitude increases when in synchrony... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWolf Posted July 26, 2008 Share Posted July 26, 2008 (edited) Like Basara and Mylene singing together eh? Or Basara and Emilia. Edited July 26, 2008 by RedWolf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weixing Posted July 26, 2008 Share Posted July 26, 2008 Hi, Hmm... From what Bilrer told Alto, seem like those the fold quartz is produce and use by the Vajra and able to overcome fold dislocation. Also, it's seem like very strong emotion in songs are able resonate with the fold quartz and travel through as fold communication wave... thus able to affect those Vajra. This is not a special ability that Ranka had as it's also shown in ep 7 when the song Sheryl sang (she was very emotional when she sing the song) can be detected by Brera and heard by Alto inside the Vajra carrier via her fold quartz earring. But Ranka (like the Vajra queen in ep 13 & 14), with all those fold quartz device embed in her body (may be that the reason Vajra see her as a queen) can resonate more easily than others. As a result, her emotion can easily affect the Vajra and from ep 14, it's seem like those Vajra emotion will also effect Ranka as well... she was wondering why she feel so sad and start crying as those Vajra was wipe out in ep 14. Also, Sheryl got the same last name as Sara Nome and Mao Nome in Macross zero... may be she is related with them... may be Mao Nome is Sheryl mother and gave her the fold quartz earring and she is also one of the descendant of the birdman?? Just my 2 cents. Happy watching and have a nice day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.T. Silversmith Posted July 26, 2008 Share Posted July 26, 2008 I've been beginning to wonder if Sheryl's earring really were her mother's. It seems much more likely that Grace gave it to her as a part of the "Fairy 9" project and told her that it was from her mother to insure that Sheryl always kept the earrings with her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFTF1 Posted July 26, 2008 Share Posted July 26, 2008 On a related albeit slightly different note- a thought in retrospect regarding the plot: When the series began, some did indeed suggest that Ranka would become super-important based on the opening credits of the series... I honestly thought that the only reason she was shown hovering around space naked was because that's just what anime girls do.... I didn't think she would be so important... In fact - I must admit that I would have prefered the result from episode 4 - that she just stayed at the chinese restaurant; and maybe that she kept singing and believing in her music; but her career didn't take off like a rocket. Not that I'm whining - but I ...err...I'm whining I guess Although I haven't seen episode 15 yet; so shouldn't talk till I do VFTF1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weixing Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Hi, I've been beginning to wonder if Sheryl's earring really were her mother's. It seems much more likely that Grace gave it to her as a part of the "Fairy 9" project and told her that it was from her mother to insure that Sheryl always kept the earrings with her. Hmm... possible, but grace doesn't seem to be worry when Sheryl lost one of the earring... Have a nice day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWolf Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 (edited) Just downloaded the gg sub with the new Aimo lyrics Ring the bell of victory now, For this star anew. Raise high our banner now, For this God's new land. Onward, Frontier embrace our unity with head held up high. Soar, Frontier awaken the power that yet sleeps. Carrying the thunderbolt in your hands, advance! Build here again our home of old! If these lyrics have any significance to Galaxy's plans it contains the intention of unifying all of the Protoculture's children at the cost of the Vajra. While the normal Aimo lyrics is more on harmony and coexistence. Galaxy intends to create a new Stellar Republic. Which is a far more ambitious than Bilrer's dream of creating a transportation version of the Galaxy Network. Edited July 27, 2008 by RedWolf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dio Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 (edited) I think it's all starting to come together now, after reading a few of the comments (haven't seen 16 yet, so forgive me if I'm totally off base) and comparing with some of my old theories. I think I might have been getting way too speculative after all. First off, I think we're letting homages give us way too much belief that this series is going to be officially connected in any way with events from other series (in particular, Macross Zero). Homages are great, but Kawamori stated pretty specifically that they're managed by other writers, which implies to me that they're not going to be integral to the story. We also know that Kawamori is big on environmentalism, harmony with nature, etc. Based on recent information, I'm beginning to think that the Vajra are going to be treated more and more as an endangered species than a legendary successor to the PC, or a science experiment gone awry on the part of humans. I'm betting now, that the Vajra were a dormant/peaceful race encountered by the research fleet (or others), and the Fold Quartz was the big discovery on their part - which they probably tried to harvest, and in their ignorance set off a battle with the Vajra. The research fleet could either have been that fleet that discovered it, or they may have been sent in to try and work out a solution with the Vajra. Zoom forward to where Galaxy probably knows about the Quartz, either from information passing to them, or from rescuing the research fleet and getting it from Brera when they rebuilt him. Now, Galaxy is something of a connected hive network as seen in the Grace & Co. conversation - they probably feel they've got the best outline for how humankind should live, and want to harvest Fold Quartz to make it a reality. Ranka may have been originally experimented on to independently create Fold Quartz in her cells, to try and establish a peaceful communication link with the Vajra. If Galaxy thought she was killed in the accident, that could explain their eagerness to try and replicate the experiment via Sheryl (hence the blood-swapping, earrings, etc). The Queen responded to Ranka's singing and was attracted by it (and now, it seems, is paralyzed by it), so they probably thought Sheryl could achieve the same results - attract them and initiate conflict. Vajra dead bodies = more Fold Quartz = ability to network all of humanity like good computers. This fits in with Kawamori's style (and current political issues, I might add) of big agencies misusing limited resources and possibly destroying entire species in the process. Eureka 7 had a similar message, did it not? The show is already standing on its own, without depending on major ties to previous Macross series for its story and themes. One example - the Protoculture are mentioned, but they'll probably just be described in short order, similar to how they were brought up in Macross 7, and not really expanded upon as anything other than a historically significant example of civilization come and gone. Or who knows, maybe they'll just be a footnote in the end credit monologue for an episode and never get mentioned again. Someone unfamiliar with earlier Macross should be able to jump right into this story and enjoy it from start to end with a minimum of background information. Also, on another topic - I think Brera's going to get the same noble resolution as Darth Vader did. He's a machine now who's been stripped of all his past ties, but they'll come back to him in the end and he'll end up having to sacrifice himself since he's already too far gone to make any appreciable return to society. No Pineapple Salad moments here - but I think we will all feel some impact from his sacrifice, if he does get to see some final redemption. Edited July 27, 2008 by Dio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoNameSt11 Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 I've been beginning to wonder if Sheryl's earring really were her mother's. It seems much more likely that Grace gave it to her as a part of the "Fairy 9" project and told her that it was from her mother to insure that Sheryl always kept the earrings with her. Once Grace revealed Sheryl was an experiment anything linking her to any 'past' is guaranteed to be fabricated. Also, the fact it's made out of fold quartz, which is the aim of the Galaxy AI, is too convenient to be a coincidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sucker4meltrans Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 What is Sheryl Nome? A. Android B. Clone C. Cyborg D. A real person that was kidnapped and then reprogrammed. E. A completely original creation of genetic engineering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sumdumgai Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Sheryl Nome is a vampire replicant with convenient amnesia that prevents her from remembering her vampiric moments. Now that she stopped taking Grace's pills that kept her bloodlust in check, Sheryl has been in a state of dissociative fugue and hasn't been drinking the blood she should, thus her state of near collapse. But soon, she will have to feed to sustain her replicant body... Or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoNameSt11 Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 What is Sheryl Nome? A. Android B. Clone C. Cyborg D. A real person that was kidnapped and then reprogrammed. E. A completely original creation of genetic engineering. Combination of B and E, she's not an exact clone but I imagine there's some real Nome genes floating around in here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kronnang Dunn Posted July 27, 2008 Author Share Posted July 27, 2008 Sheryl Nome is a vampire replicant Is that you, Sivil? BOMBA!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d3v Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Is that you, Sivil? BOMBA!!! So she's a Nome clone/Protodevlin? Will wonders never cease, it seems most of the women in this show are more than they seem (what with Ranka being a FAST pack/Vajra hybrid and Grace being the final cylon/part of the Patriots). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Togo Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 I think Sheryl is a clone, which really works with her playing up her "all natural" appeal. Irony FTW. I'm still sticking with the Vajra being a human creation, perhaps an unintended byproduct of early experimentation with "Fold Quartz". In a way, they are humankind's own Protodeviln. As far as the Ranka/Aimo connection, well, I'm not entirely sure. I could guess that her mother had something to do with the creation of the Vajra, and perhaps the Vajra have some genetic memory of an earlier, more peaceful time involving Ranka's mother and that song. But, I dunno. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VF-25 Messiah Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Ranka's not actually a FAST-pack, we were only meant to think she was! In truth she is an incarnation of Basara's Sound Booster for his VF-19Kai. Her soundbooster ancestory is what enables her to sing and be heard in space, even without speakers! It all makes sense now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenius Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 I put this in the 16 thread but I'll reiterate it here. Maybe there's a super Vajra we haven't seen yet. A king to the queen. Galaxy needs to find this King and have it killed to eliminate fold irregularities and so they're using Frontier to do the dirty work for them. Frontier will engage in war with the Vajra that will cause the emotion index to peak at some point which will awaken the king vajra. When it appears to lay the deathblow to Frontier, Galaxy will show up and eliminate the king thus ending all fold disturbances. If the plot were to go this direction at all, I would think Galaxy's plan would be undone by Ranka finding a peaceful way to reach the king vajra. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Togo Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 I put this in the 16 thread but I'll reiterate it here. Maybe there's a super Vajra we haven't seen yet. A king to the queen. You are assuming there would be one? They are hive creatures, I am assuming there isn't one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenius Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 It's just another idea. I don't see any reason why a group of creatures in space would have to resemble earth-borne hives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kronnang Dunn Posted July 27, 2008 Author Share Posted July 27, 2008 (edited) I put this in the 16 thread but I'll reiterate it here. Maybe there's a super Vajra we haven't seen yet. A king to the queen. Galaxy needs to find this King and have it killed to eliminate fold irregularities and so they're using Frontier to do the dirty work for them. Frontier will engage in war with the Vajra that will cause the emotion index to peak at some point which will awaken the king vajra. When it appears to lay the deathblow to Frontier, Galaxy will show up and eliminate the king thus ending all fold disturbances. If the plot were to go this direction at all, I would think Galaxy's plan would be undone by Ranka finding a peaceful way to reach the king vajra. I agree with you about the existence of a Vajra King (already mentioned that theory a while ago)... But I hardly believe fold dislocations are produced by the Vajra at all. They seem to be able to overcome/dominate them though... Edited July 27, 2008 by Kronnang Dunn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobbes221 Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 We have Grace and those that she is working with are saying that they will do something that has not been done before and then we have Alto's boss telling Alto that he wants to make the problem of fold faults a thing of the past. (not what he said word for word but basic idea, at least I think) So what if Grace and Co. are not controlling or using the Vajra but instead WANT to use them as they seem to have no problem with fold faults. That could be what Grace is trying to get the Frontier fleet to do, wipe out enough Vajra so that those that are left can be rounded up and put to use. Kind of an out there theory but I am having a hard time thinking up reason as to why the SMS was tasked to round up those dead Vajra at the start of episode 16. (and if anyone has said this already, sorry I'm a little out of date on the theories thread.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Togo Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 It's just another idea. I don't see any reason why a group of creatures in space would have to resemble earth-borne hives. Because it makes sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Kind of an out there theory but I am having a hard time thinking up reason as to why the SMS was tasked to round up those dead Vajra at the start of episode 16. (and if anyone has said this already, sorry I'm a little out of date on the theories thread.) Even the bridge bunnies are confused: "Maybe they are for research" "Probably for food" I'll say, Frontier just got a new Frontier Aquarium with a new yellow squid in it. If everything started to make sense, then it wouldn't be interesting anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamweaver13 Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Even the bridge bunnies are confused: "Maybe they are for research" "Probably for food" I'll say, Frontier just got a new Frontier Aquarium with a new yellow squid in it. If everything started to make sense, then it wouldn't be interesting anymore. Island 26: Vajra Theme Park! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoNameSt11 Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 After rewatching 16, I'm expecting the harvesting of Fold Quartz from the Vajra to turn out a lot like whale hunting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamweaver13 Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 After rewatching 16, I'm expecting the harvesting of Fold Quartz from the Vajra to turn out a lot like whale hunting. waitaminute... just realized. isn't this Fold Quartz thing starting to sound like the Chulip Crystals concept in Martian Successor Nadesico? hehe, a case of the parody being parodied/referenced by the original? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWolf Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 After rewatching 16, I'm expecting the harvesting of Fold Quartz from the Vajra to turn out a lot like whale hunting. The illegal space whaling industry went bankrupt after Nekki Basara sang to the space whales and gave them lots of Spiritia. Since they can't hunt space whales because it is a crime poaching Vajra is perfectly legal. Woohoo! New industry! Though I don't think they can make guitar string with Vajra. Though by the end of this series Vajra will declared a protected species. A Galaxy Patrol division will have to be set up there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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