Gubaba Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 The next two or three episodes immediately after the Pegasus arc are a bit clunky. But stick with it, and you'll be rewarded by season's end. Yeah..."Black Market" and "Scar" were both less satisfying than the previous episodes...but maybe that's just because it seems like Starbuck and Apollo are both losing their edge, and that's something that I don't really want to see happen. It makes sense as far as the story's concerned (in other words, I think the story NEEDS to go there), but it's not the kind of thing that grabbed me about the show. What was so compelling about the miniseries and the first season was seeing normal people put into positions where they had to make impossible decisions, with high-stakes ramifications. After Pegasus, it seems to be asking, "What happens when people are sick of making those choices, and being pushed to the brink every day?" And the answer so far seems to be, "They want oblivion." Which is reasonable, and something they need to deal with, but Lee wishing for death and Starbuck becoming a sloppy drunk...well, it's not fun to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Not a fan of either episode for me as well. Black Market is just a bad episode. Feels rushed and obvious that they knew what they wanted but not how to get it. Didn't like Scar because, I just don't like Kat all that much and I didn't think it was particularly realistic how she went from a drugged out loser to a respected hot shot Ace that other pilots would give a rats ass about... especially considering what a whiny self righteous b!tch she is for the *entire* episode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Snowblind- Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 I think RDM said something to the effect that Black Market was the only episode he regrets and wishes he could take back. It's pretty much universally disliked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaijin Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Of the whole series, Black Market is the worst. It really feels "unlike" a typical BSG episode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
505thAirborne Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Thankfully with even a dud episode like Black Market, theres always "Someone to watch over me" which is probably one of the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azrael Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Gubaba should listen to RDM's podcasts for each episode while he watches the episodes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Gubaba should listen to RDM's podcasts for each episode while he watches the episodes. The podcasts are the commentary tracks on the DVDs.. there's some I wish he had redone for the DVD though... the ones where he and his wife are just chatting aren't particularly interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Gubaba should listen to RDM's podcasts for each episode while he watches the episodes. Hmmm...I'll probably end up buying the DVDs if I find them used...I'll probably check 'em out then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 (edited) I think RDM said something to the effect that Black Market was the only episode he regrets and wishes he could take back. It's pretty much universally disliked. Three things I liked about "Black Market": 1) Again with the parallels: Roslin offers Baltar "a way out," just as the crime boss offers Lee "a way out." 2) Prostitution and black market goods would be a reality in the fleet, and it was nice to see them addressed (but with Lee? Young man, I'm gravely disappointed in you! ). 3) Lee shooting the guy in the middle of a typical "You're not going to pull the trigger" speech. Other than that...yeah...I think it was an interesting experiment, to try to fit a cop-show story into the Galactica world, but it didn't work. Maybe it would've been better as a continuing subplot across three or four episodes, rather than crammed into one. Everything moved too fast, and there was no real sense of momentum to it. Edited November 20, 2009 by Gubaba Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Well, the show got better right quick...but I can't believe they killed Billy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azrael Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Well, the show got better right quick...but I can't believe they killed Billy... Best not to get too attached to any character. They're all gonna die! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Best not to get too attached to any character. They're all gonna die! Hmmm...I'm kind of attached to Sharon, and they can kill her as many times as they want. I also like Roslin a lot...and I was POSITIVE that she was going to die, but she didn't (I assume it WILL happen at some point, though...I mean, there's the prophecy and all that...but then, her vision of "a dozen snakes" was interpreted differently by Baltar and Six...so...I dunno). I like the Chief a lot, and I liked Billy. Starbuck of course is awesome...Lee was a douche at the beginning, but I've warmed up to him a bit. Gaeta's pretty great, too. But I think my all-time favorite is the chain-smoking doctor. Pure comic genius! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Hmmm...I'm kind of attached to Sharon, and they can kill her as many times as they want. I also like Roslin a lot...and I was POSITIVE that she was going to die, but she didn't (I assume it WILL happen at some point, though...I mean, there's the prophecy and all that...but then, her vision of "a dozen snakes" was interpreted differently by Baltar and Six...so...I dunno). I like the Chief a lot, and I liked Billy. Starbuck of course is awesome...Lee was a douche at the beginning, but I've warmed up to him a bit. Gaeta's pretty great, too. But I think my all-time favorite is the chain-smoking doctor. Pure comic genius! man, it's like a hit list... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hingtgen Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Or more likely, a list of characters you may absolutely despise in a season or two... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Ah...Caprica Six. Now I get it. Seriously, that was one of the best episodes of the entire series so far. It must have been fun for the actors...from nervous and on-edge Baltar and cool and collected Six to nervous Six and cool Baltar. And I'm glad to see that Boomer is still well, so to speak. So let's see...Lucy Lawless is Three, the P.R. guy who looks kind of like Steve Carrell is Five, Six is Six, and Sharon is Eight...do I have that right? Am am I reading too much into it to think there's a Prisoner reference in all this...? Don't answer that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaijin Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Ah...Caprica Six. Now I get it. Seriously, that was one of the best episodes of the entire series so far. It must have been fun for the actors...from nervous and on-edge Baltar and cool and collected Six to nervous Six and cool Baltar. And I'm glad to see that Boomer is still well, so to speak. So let's see...Lucy Lawless is Three, the P.R. guy who looks kind of like Steve Carrell is Five, Six is Six, and Sharon is Eight...do I have that right? Am am I reading too much into it to think there's a Prisoner reference in all this...? Don't answer that. Don't ask. Just sit back and enjoy the ride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobber Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Not a fan of either episode for me as well. Black Market is just a bad episode. Feels rushed and obvious that they knew what they wanted but not how to get it. Didn't like Scar because, I just don't like Kat all that much and I didn't think it was particularly realistic how she went from a drugged out loser to a respected hot shot Ace that other pilots would give a rats ass about... especially considering what a whiny self righteous b!tch she is for the *entire* episode. Yeah, that episode single handedly made me DESPISE Kat....and then we are supposed to care for her later on . Besides, she only got the kill because Starbuck led scar to her...not to mention that Starbuck saved both of their asses by checking their six. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindem Herz Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Yeah, that episode single handedly made me DESPISE Kat....and then we are supposed to care for her later on . Besides, she only got the kill because Starbuck led scar to her...not to mention that Starbuck saved both of their asses by checking their six. Chris That is standard wingmen procedure: if you cannot get the bandit, set it up so you wing will. And you have four pair of eyes instead of two for the same reason: if you cannot see the bandit, then your wingman might. That's the safest, more efficient way to hunt on a fighter, collaborating with the second part of the pair. Something that neither Kat nor Starbuck were willing to do, I may add. I actually liked her development (but not the character itself) because I saw her trying to overcompensate for the pills incident earlier on the season. She's the insecure natural: she has the skills to pull it through but she's too unsure of herself that she has to prove it all over again every time she can. Even worst, in the inside she knows she's being childish and it might be a very dangerous thing - and I think she realizes that when Starbuck starts recalling the name of the dead, to the point of being angry to herself. I think if she was in a real, properly organized military, with enough training, she would have had enough time to weed that out before it became dangerous for herself and her wingmen (after all, she put her poo remarkably together after the months of pure training and military hardening Adama imposed on them before the assault on New Caprica, and didn't drop it until her ex showed up). But this ain't that. This is frakking Battlestar Galactica. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobber Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Yeah, I understand how the flight dynamic works. I was more reffering to how she acted afterwards like she did it all herself. Forgot about Starbuck essentially putting her in her place, though, with the names of the fallen. That was good. I actually found the development of Starbuck better...in this episode....because she showed the maturity to do what needed to be done, as you described above. More what you would expect from a senior officer and the flight lead. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Yeah, I understand how the flight dynamic works. I was more reffering to how she acted afterwards like she did it all herself. Forgot about Starbuck essentially putting her in her place, though, with the names of the fallen. That was good. I actually found the development of Starbuck better...in this episode....because she showed the maturity to do what needed to be done, as you described above. More what you would expect from a senior officer and the flight lead. Chris I'm not sure I trust her as CAG, though...we'll see where it goes. I just hope she stops drinking so heavily. I'll be finishing Season 2 today. If my DVD provider brings Season 3 to me this weekend, I'll continue on. If not, I'll go back to laughing at the original series for a week or so (Maybe I could actually finish it? I'm more than halfway through...not counting the execrable Galactica 1980, of course). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobber Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Oh you are in for something! Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
505thAirborne Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 It will be great when your all finished with BSG Gubaba, its torture at times keeping all the spoilers or best parts to ourselves. j/k Seriously by the time your done with the series, you'll probably want a whole collection of toys & models!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hingtgen Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Ooooh, the very end of season 2. Probably my fave moment in the series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Ooooh, the very end of season 2. Probably my fave moment in the series. Christ, you guys weren't kidding about surprises ahead...I watched "Lay Down Your Burdens" Part 1, and the whole episode seemed like set-up. Then I started watching Part 2, and it continued to seem like set-up. And then...Cloud Nine were ka-blooey, it felt like the pay-off was about to start, and then... Well, as you all know, it jumped PAST the pay-off; if I hadn't known there were more seasons coming up, I would've thought it was an epilogue or something. As it is...WHAT THE HELL IS HAPPENING??? (Again, don't answer that.) Now I really don't know where the show's going anymore... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hingtgen Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 What, you thought they were going to stay on board the Galactica forever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Einherjar Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 (edited) Christ, you guys weren't kidding about surprises ahead...I watched "Lay Down Your Burdens" Part 1, and the whole episode seemed like set-up. Then I started watching Part 2, and it continued to seem like set-up. And then...Cloud Nine were ka-blooey, it felt like the pay-off was about to start, and then... Well, as you all know, it jumped PAST the pay-off; if I hadn't known there were more seasons coming up, I would've thought it was an epilogue or something. As it is...WHAT THE HELL IS HAPPENING??? (Again, don't answer that.) Now I really don't know where the show's going anymore... I remember back then, it was very agonizing because people were forced to wait almost a year to find out what the heck they were going with this. Year after year, sometimes they cut it off at half a season. Edited November 21, 2009 by Einherjar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azrael Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Christ, you guys weren't kidding about surprises ahead...I watched "Lay Down Your Burdens" Part 1, and the whole episode seemed like set-up. Then I started watching Part 2, and it continued to seem like set-up. And then...Cloud Nine were ka-blooey, it felt like the pay-off was about to start, and then... Told ya they're gonna die. Oh you're gonna love next season. More people will die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
505thAirborne Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Just wait til Season 3, you'll get to see whats referred to as "The Adama Maneuver" one of the best scenes of the series!!! And sadly yes, more people will die...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mog Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 I believe you'll be utterring the phrase, "Oh frak!!" a number of times during the start of Season 3. Not sure if the Season 3 DVDs have 'em, but there's also a few "webisodes" that fill in the gap between Season 2 and Season 3. They're each usually just a few minutes long, and they focus mostly on some minor characters. But it'll be good background filler for when you start up Season 3. If you thought the poop had hit the fan before, just wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Definitely watch the webisodes for season 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the white drew carey Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Just wait til Season 3, you'll get to see whats referred to as "The Adama Maneuver" one of the best scenes of the series!!! What I think is possibly one of the most exciting moments in any media- past, present, or future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 I believe you'll be utterring the phrase, "Oh frak!!" a number of times during the start of Season 3. Not sure if the Season 3 DVDs have 'em, but there's also a few "webisodes" that fill in the gap between Season 2 and Season 3. They're each usually just a few minutes long, and they focus mostly on some minor characters. But it'll be good background filler for when you start up Season 3. If you thought the poop had hit the fan before, just wait. Yeah...my DVD provider said that Episode 1 of Season 3 was the first episode she ever saw, and she was hooked instantly. I saw her briefly yesterday, and told her I was finishing up Season 2, so she'd BETTER bring Season 3 when I see her today... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
505thAirborne Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 What I think is possibly one of the most exciting moments in any media- past, present, or future. Without doubt!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobber Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 (edited) Yup agree. Unfortunately...for ME....I felt that the show lost something after that episode. Don't get me wrong, LOVED the series, but I felt the second half of S3 - the end, the show just lost something for me. Chris Edited November 21, 2009 by Dobber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Snowblind- Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Mid-way through Season 3 the fanbase seems to have split on their opinions of the show. Most people seemed to really like the direction it was going, but there was also a sizable group that were disappointed. There's definitely a noticeable shift after the first 4 or 5 episodes of season 3, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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