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Macross/Animation Cel Collection Thread


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On 10/7/2017 at 9:30 AM, JetJockey said:

I think I'm going to deal with Urban Treasure Hunter, they found something I might want. I never saw it on Yahoo Japan either. But I have to confirm it this weekend.

Go for it.... if you have the budget.... while they are not cheap, I think his stuff is good (since most of it is YJA curated anyways) haha

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Many of us feel buying from deadbeat scalpers like urbantreasurehunterjapan only encourages them to prey on collectors and the public.  It is a vicious cycle whenever someone buys anything from scalpers.  Prospective buyers have two main choices, you can choose to a) help their business grow by buying from them, or b) remove a purchase from their business and effectively voice your dissent.  The choice is always yours.

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10 hours ago, Fortress_Maximus said:

Many of us feel buying from deadbeat scalpers like urbantreasurehunterjapan only encourages them to prey on collectors and the public.  It is a vicious cycle whenever someone buys anything from scalpers.  Prospective buyers have two main choices, you can choose to a) help their business grow by buying from them, or b) remove a purchase from their business and effectively voice your dissent.  The choice is always yours.

Don't forget the best choice.....buy the cel when it is first listed on YJA so you don't have to pay his ludicrous "finder's fee"! ;)

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We've previously discussed ways to identify and avoid counterfeit cels (aka fakes, commission, fan-made, reproductions, etc), but let's also discuss how counterfeit drawings also exist.   What are other collectors experiences regarding shikishis (aka artboards typically used for original sketches in JP)?  Typically I've encountered counterfeit shikishis being offered as authentic mainly by less established YJA sellers who also are not dealers.  I've previously asked, do others feel it is important that a seller has business longevity?  Does it matter to you if the seller has established contacts and sells original artworks obtained from the artists themselves?  And lastly, what type of seller do you think is more likely to attempt to sell (knowingly or unknowingly) counterfeit cels and original artworks? 

So on that note, as a warning to shikishi collectors it is in your best interest to avoid YJA user m4a12011 https://auctions.yahoo.co.jp/seller/m4a12011?ngram=1  This is one of many counterfeit sellers on YJA.  

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Hi guys:

This is my first post. I've recently found this seller apple_symphony_xx who is offering Marcross Sketch of Minmay on JYA

Does this seems legit to you?

http://buyee.jp/item/yahoo/auction/h284921525


At just 5000 yen, it seems to be GREAT value at the price he offered even if it does not come with cel.

Any comments are appreciated.

Regards

Ken

 

842x612-2017100200005.jpg

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13 hours ago, ANTEATERNEO said:

Hi guys:

This is my first post. I've recently found this seller apple_symphony_xx who is offering Marcross Sketch of Minmay on JYA

Does this seems legit to you?

http://buyee.jp/item/yahoo/auction/h284921525


At just 5000 yen, it seems to be GREAT value at the price he offered even if it does not come with cel.

Any comments are appreciated.

Regards

Ken

 

842x612-2017100200005.jpg

That seller is legit....he's been trying to sell the same gengas for a while....guess most collectors are all about the cels....

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7 hours ago, jvmacross said:

That seller is legit....he's been trying to sell the same gengas for a while....guess most collectors are all about the cels....

Hmmm this seems kind of the going rate for these genga..... there are a few different posts for about this price per piece.... and as the detail increase seems the costs also go up...

http://buyee.jp/item/yahoo/auction/h284921509

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32 minutes ago, juice14 said:

Hmmm this seems kind of the going rate for these genga..... there are a few different posts for about this price per piece.... and as the detail increase seems the costs also go up...

http://buyee.jp/item/yahoo/auction/h284921509

Yes, I've noticed. It starts from 4000 yen and goes up toward 25000 and beyond. Nevertheless, at nice and mostly importantly a legit genga of Minmay or Misa at 5000 yen for me is great value as "one of the kind" souvenir. Quite a bargain!   

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 10/13/2017 at 2:59 PM, Fortress_Maximus said:

We've previously discussed ways to identify and avoid counterfeit cels (aka fakes, commission, fan-made, reproductions, etc), but let's also discuss how counterfeit drawings also exist.   What are other collectors experiences regarding shikishis (aka artboards typically used for original sketches in JP)?  Typically I've encountered counterfeit shikishis being offered as authentic mainly by less established YJA sellers who also are not dealers.  I've previously asked, do others feel it is important that a seller has business longevity?  Does it matter to you if the seller has established contacts and sells original artworks obtained from the artists themselves?  And lastly, what type of seller do you think is more likely to attempt to sell (knowingly or unknowingly) counterfeit cels and original artworks? 

So on that note, as a warning to shikishi collectors it is in your best interest to avoid YJA user m4a12011 https://auctions.yahoo.co.jp/seller/m4a12011?ngram=1  This is one of many counterfeit sellers on YJA.  

Not really into the shikishi collecting...but I have also seen this seller: https://auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/show/rating?userID=art_sukisuki2012

Have you had any dealings with this seller?  Is this seller legit?  Personally, I'd rather buy from a collector than someone specifically in the market selling these types of items. I guess it just feels better that the cel or artwork is going from one fan to another.

What about this seller?

https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/v520754238

 

Anyway, I only have one "shikishi"....and it is the one shikishi to rule them all....so I'm good....8)

gallery_12176_600_1709367.jpg

 

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No dealings with YJA user art_sukisuki2012.  Once he reposts some items I can confirm if he lists counterfeits.  Researched jeet_kun_do1972 some of his items are authentic.  But need to examine specific listings to confirm if he deals with counterfeits like YJA user m4a12011.

Your shikishi by Tenjin is quite impressive, congratulations on obtaining it.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Any of you guys deal with Viviere on ebay before? They have this Rook cel up for $370.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Anime-Macross-Robotech-New-Generation-cel-6/332451509327?hash=item4d67a7744f:g:kSgAAOSwl9RaDRG2

5a0d51ee94ee7_RookCel.jpg.3645c0ab8efbb2a240c58180cb38be29.jpg

I'm sure I've seen this scene before perhaps once or twice but I need to search my files. They might be another flipper. They have a few Macross cels and other anime items up as well. One negative feedback from a buyer says they were "deceived" so I'm not jumping to deal with them.

 

 

 

 

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@JetJockey Solid sellers, dealt with them before.  As stated in their auctions they sell items on consignment.  The negative feedback means very little considering you do not know the facts or the details involving the transaction.  In my experience it is prudent to refrain from jumping to unsubstantiated conclusions.  Bottom line, one negative means nothing considering this seller has been around for well over a decade.  Your mileage may vary but bad buyers and sellers disappear far quicker than this sellers longevity.

Edited by Fortress_Maximus
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I searched my files for that Rook cel and this Viviere seller on ebay is in the same league as UrbanTreasureHunter if not worse. I noted on the file name that the same, if not similar, Rook cel sold for 4400 Yen. Today that's basically $40. So Viviere marked this up by $330! Give me a break. This guy is flipper central. At least UrbanTreasureHunter puts his cels on sale for 25% off and even goes lower via offers. Add in Viviere's negative feedback and other instances that I see when going over their feedback that's more than a year old. And you have a seller I won't deal with unless they get something really good.

Edited by JetJockey
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17 minutes ago, jvmacross said:

25% off of triple (at minimum) the final YJA final auction sale price?

Did you type that up with a straight face?  LOL....I 

Of course I did. I passed on getting one of UrbanTreasureHunter's cels. Another Rook one. I decided to get the VF-31C, some other stuff, and wait for the Mospeada items next year. But UrbanTreasureHunter has yet to get a cel that I really want. I did meet another collector that purchased from UrbanTreasureHunter that's why I know some stuff about their auctions. And triple is nothing compared to what that Viviere Rook cel is priced at. And they don't seem open to offers going by their auction setup. But perhaps I will ask and see. The price is so insulting to start that I doubt they will offer down to $100 which is where it should be maximum.

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Asinine analysis underscored by petulance and an entitlement mindset.  Do you understand how consignment operates?  The fact is even if a consignment seller wants to price an item lower it is not their decision because owners dictate minimum pricing requirements.  Whereas urbantreasurehunterjapan does not sell items for collectors; they own everything they resell and they alone dictate the list price.  Your esteemed urbantreasurehunterjapan mark up all items for well over 200%, then offer their magnanimous 25% discount.  Real examples are these two Flashback cels https://www.ebay.com/itm/MACROSS-FLASHBACK-ROBOTECH-LYNN-MINMAY-ANIME-PRODUCTION-CEL-3/401008042919?hash=item5d5df123a7:g:3fMAAOSwA4dWF3Yh and https://www.ebay.com/itm/MACROSS-FLASHBACK-ROBOTECH-LYNN-MINMAY-ANIME-PRODUCTION-CEL-2/401008042316?hash=item5d5df1214c:g:RREAAOSwT5tWF3We . The two cels were offered in one auction that sold for less than $700 USD.  As the epitome of a scalper, urbantreasurehunterjapan true to form lists each cel on ebay separately for $1,199.99 and $974.99.  Unsurprisingly these two cels remain unsold as do the majority of their items primarily due to their listing practices.  It would behoove you to learn how to objectively research facts and not rely on anecdotal evidence.

Edited by Fortress_Maximus
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  • 1 month later...
  • 2 weeks later...
On 12/27/2017 at 5:57 PM, jvmacross said:

I think 2017 was the first year in a while that I did not add any new Macross cels to my collection......Hoping something comes up 2018...:unknw:

Hey, it’s already 2018!  Where are the new cels?

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  • 1 month later...

I have been following this forum for a long while and finally took the time to signup - Hello everyone!

Really appreciate you sharing your cels and knowledge on all things Macross/Robotech etc. 

The opening theme still sends shivers down my spine and takes me back to the 80's. Love the story and the characters - watched the original Macross last year (for the first time) and was trying to piece together what got put into Robotech and what didn't ha ha. 

Further, have just bought my first cel (will share when it arrives in the post) and am also in the process of acquiring a few Douga's. Will be great to get some feedback on these ;)

Other than yahoo JPN and eBay, are there any other sources you guys recommend checking out for cels/dougas?

ATB

 

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@saffabrat.....

Nice stuff...thanks for sharing and welcome to MW!  

As for where else to buy....there are a few, the biggest (most expensive) one online being Anime Link....but you may as well buy whatever you like off of YJA when you see it before they do and jack up the price!

 

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https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/j476283208

msn6000-img450x318-1519848074oupww119050

 

It is a beautiful illustration....the only other "officially" published example of it comes from the Macross Gold Book....

vt1.jpeg

 

As you can see, it is drastically different...even though the main focal point, the Super O, is essentially the same.

Several theories were bounced around...perhaps the Gold Book one is the "rough" sketch and the one sold via YJA is the final drawing....but why use the rough one on the Gold Book?  And why has this pic not appeared anywhere else?....I do not collect the doujins of the SDFM/DYRL era, so I am wondering if the "cleaner" illustration may have appeared in one of them....any doujin collectors out there that can check their books?

The other thing about the illustration is the lack of any signature...usually Kawamori signs his work, like his lineart.  Or perhaps this one is actually drawn by Miyatake?  The illustration is very similar to his Destroid and Mecha illustrations....very "clean" and "mechanically-realistic" in execution...also there are some examples of VF-1's drawn by Miyatake to add to the posssibilty of this being a Miyatake illustration.....however, I believe he too signs his work.

The seller does not give any indication of knowing anything about the VT-1 illustration, where he got it from or who the illustrator is.

There was no way to be certain as to the legitamacy of the illustration....even so, it is awesome nonetheless!  

Any of the other Macross cel and original art collectors here have any further insights into this illustration?

And no, I did not win it, I would have liked to but not at the final price with too much uncertainty....this one got to stay in Japan I believe.....;)

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7 hours ago, saffabrat said:

Yeah... I just bought it... Lets see what its like....

@saffabrat What does it look like?

@jvmacross: Saw the drawing and questioned the authenticity.  There is no reason why it should not include the additional shading if this was authentic.  Agree about the final pricing it went higher than I too think it is worth; besides not a fan of the ostrich more of the elint.  If I had to make an educated guess it is a fan version or at best a draft that never had the final touches (which to me are important).

@saffabrat And I concur with jvmacross about taking some calculated risks when collecting.  One thing I'd add is as a new collector do your best not to go into debt over a hobby, seriously.  Prioritize all of your other required expenses (retirement, housing, debts, food, maintenance, etc) and set aside monies for your fun things like hobbies; doing so will reduce the likelihood of going into debt plus collectors burning out.  Collecting artwork and particularly cels is not for everyone and especially not for the faint of heart (emotionally and financially).  Good luck!

Edited by Fortress_Maximus
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