reddsun1 Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Actually, some drivers do run slicks, but only up front, for the most part. However, one driver with a very powerful car, his name escapes me ATM, runs rear slicks. Chunking is a major problem, but there are vast difference between brands and specific tire models, and drifters have figured out what's good, and what isn't. An interesting thing about drift is that you can tell a good tire by the smell of the smoke. My Falkens, and to a lesser extent, Yokohamas, smell pretty good (comparitively) when they're burning off the car. Cheap tires, on the other hand, are pretty nasty, rangine from relatively neutral Bridgestones to horrible smelling brands like Futura or some of the Chinese / Korean brands. Tire smoke? smells good? Ack! I've never been partial to it myself. Now racing gas off a car's exhaust--now THAT'S some sweet smelling stuff, baby! "I love the smell of racing gas in the morning." I guess it comes from when I used to groove racing slicks--I was always thinking in the back of my mind how "this sh-t's got to be toxic...can't possibly be good for me." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
areaseven Posted March 23, 2005 Author Share Posted March 23, 2005 It's a sad day in the automotive industry today. John Z. DeLorean Dead at 80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowlightman Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 It's a sad day in the automotive industry today.John Z. DeLorean Dead at 80 He made a shitty, shitty car. Er... ok? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
areaseven Posted March 23, 2005 Author Share Posted March 23, 2005 He made a shitty, shitty car. Er... ok? Okay, the DMC may be slow and unreliable, but let's not forget that DeLorean created the original Pontiac GTO (not the rebadged Holden Monaro). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phyrox Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 He made a shitty, shitty car. Er... ok? Okay, the DMC may be slow and unreliable, but let's not forget that DeLorean created the original Pontiac GTO (not the rebadged Holden Monaro). ...and the 2nd gen T/A. his work at Pontiac is his real legacy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander McBride Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Actually, some drivers do run slicks, but only up front, for the most part. However, one driver with a very powerful car, his name escapes me ATM, runs rear slicks. Chunking is a major problem, but there are vast difference between brands and specific tire models, and drifters have figured out what's good, and what isn't. An interesting thing about drift is that you can tell a good tire by the smell of the smoke. My Falkens, and to a lesser extent, Yokohamas, smell pretty good (comparitively) when they're burning off the car. Cheap tires, on the other hand, are pretty nasty, rangine from relatively neutral Bridgestones to horrible smelling brands like Futura or some of the Chinese / Korean brands. Tire smoke? smells good? Ack! I've never been partial to it myself. Now racing gas off a car's exhaust--now THAT'S some sweet smelling stuff, baby! "I love the smell of racing gas in the morning." I guess it comes from when I used to groove racing slicks--I was always thinking in the back of my mind how "this sh-t's got to be toxic...can't possibly be good for me." I wouldn't say it's an attractive smell exactly, but, much like the smell of racing gas, it's the kinda thing that really hits home in a racer's heart, or however you want to put it. When you drift, the small of good tires starts to become an integral part of the experience. What I mean, though, is that you can tell a good tire by its smell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSW Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Damn!...been away from this thread for too long Anyway as a fellow 2ed gen T/A fan, and former (and likely future) owner of several Phyrox asked a question a goo while back: This is a question for those who really know their automotive history. So, I found this picture on a site devoted to 2nd Gen. firebird/Trans Ams...seems to be a scan out of a book. The caption boils down to: the 2nd gen was the first T/A ever designed, and that the '69 version was designed to be transitional. Could this also imply that the 2nd gen. was designed before the one-year-only '69 model? This would explain why the '69 is so unattractive, being designed to bridge the earlier 1st gens. and the 2nd gens, rather than for its own aesthetics. Now this is going by memory..so some of it could be way off...Chevy got into the the then still new TA race series with thier 302cid Z-28...and what races on sunday sells on monday, And Pontiac was getting a bit jealious that thier own pony car wasn't selling (not to mention American Motors and the boys at Dodge were prepareing thier own entries)...problem was that they didn't have a competative engine to meet the max 305cid Trans Am raceing rule...thus the late start Poncho engineers came up with the 303cid, but it wasn't looking to promiseing. IIRC, Delorean (may he rest in peace) was still in charge at Pontiac then...they opted the Trans Am name, but didn't have a car yet...what we know as the 1970 model year firebirds were originaly suppost to appear in 1969...engineering was hard at work on them (Delorean had been trying to make a Pontiac firebird named sports car sense the 1950s...and Pontiac wasn't too happy about inheriting the Chevy developed Camero pony car design...so there was pressure from Pontiac to have much more say in how the 2ed generation developed)...However (IIRC) the plan for a 1969 Firebird T/A began to fall appart when there was a big workers strike...so the 2ed gen got pushed back (actualy didn't hit showrooms til february 1970...makeing them 70.5 models) and in the meantime the engine wizards were still trying to make the lil 303cid both competitive and reliable enough to be sell enough cars to be homologated into the T/A race series...but the engine wasn't up to snuff...and the rule makers of the T/A race series decided to drop the engine homologation requirement (still had to be a production car...just didn't have to have a engine under the 305cid cap)...so what we know as the 1969 Pontiac T/A was the result of that (it too was a mid model year car)...it was just sorta thrown together last minute like so Pontiac could race in the following season... The 303cid motor never really woked right, and Pontiac...under the graces of the T/A race committee...mostly ended up useing the Chevy 302cid engines in thier race cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trueblueeyes Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Reddsun1 is right, tire smoke is awful. I remember getting an assigned spot at Gateway in St. Louis where the wind constantly blew the smoke from the burn-out box in my direction. As if that wasn't enough to give me a headache, even though we were not right at the staging lanes we were close enough so that I went back to the hotel that night with burnout box ear. As for other track smells: VP racing fuel is not that bad, but any car running alcohol (even with scents added) smells horrible to me. I'm still trying to get ready for my next event. (Fun Ford Weekend in Bella Rose, Lousiana on April 1-3) Need to remove my fuel cell and reinstall the gas tank so I can make the 30 mile road cruise required for True Street. Oh joy, just how I wanted to spend this weekend. And that is assuming I get my new pulley for the 'charger in time...bearings gone bad in less than a year...what a joke. On top of that, our truck is in the shop so I've got to borrow my Dad's Lightning. With gas prices, I'll be broke before I get to the track. I don't mean to complain so much as I really am looking forward to it. Just so much I have to do to get ready in such a short time. And my engine builder will be there, so I don't want to embarass myself. Wouldn't it be lovely to spend all the time, effort, and money to get there and then red-light in the finals? Been there, done that. Wish me luck folks. I would *love* to set up a car for Auto-X'ing but there is literally no track anywhere within a hundred miles of where I live where I could run. The closest track to me of any kind is a piss-poor drag strip that is only 1/8 mile and guess what is at the end of the track to stop you if you can't do it on your own? A cornfield...I kid you not. Wouldn't that be a way to go...lose control of your car and get impaled by an ear of corn? In an seriousness though, much respect to those of you who are part of the circuit. I really do think I would be more scared pushing a car through a corner on a wet surface even at (relatively) low speeds than I would ever running a 9 sec. car on a 10.5 slick. I just point and shoot and relay on Mr. Moser and Mr. Strange for help. You have to work every second to keep your car under control. That is something everyone should understand and respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phyrox Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Damn!...been away from this thread for too long Anyway as a fellow 2ed gen T/A fan, and former (and likely future) owner of several Phyrox asked a question a goo while back: This is a question for those who really know their automotive history. So, I found this picture on a site devoted to 2nd Gen. firebird/Trans Ams...seems to be a scan out of a book. The caption boils down to: the 2nd gen was the first T/A ever designed, and that the '69 version was designed to be transitional. Could this also imply that the 2nd gen. was designed before the one-year-only '69 model? This would explain why the '69 is so unattractive, being designed to bridge the earlier 1st gens. and the 2nd gens, rather than for its own aesthetics. Now this is going by memory..so some of it could be way off...Chevy got into the the then still new TA race series with thier 302cid Z-28...and what races on sunday sells on monday, And Pontiac was getting a bit jealious that thier own pony car wasn't selling (not to mention American Motors and the boys at Dodge were prepareing thier own entries)...problem was that they didn't have a competative engine to meet the max 305cid Trans Am raceing rule...thus the late start Poncho engineers came up with the 303cid, but it wasn't looking to promiseing. IIRC, Delorean (may he rest in peace) was still in charge at Pontiac then...they opted the Trans Am name, but didn't have a car yet...what we know as the 1970 model year firebirds were originaly suppost to appear in 1969...engineering was hard at work on them (Delorean had been trying to make a Pontiac firebird named sports car sense the 1950s...and Pontiac wasn't too happy about inheriting the Chevy developed Camero pony car design...so there was pressure from Pontiac to have much more say in how the 2ed generation developed)...However (IIRC) the plan for a 1969 Firebird T/A began to fall appart when there was a big workers strike...so the 2ed gen got pushed back (actualy didn't hit showrooms til february 1970...makeing them 70.5 models) and in the meantime the engine wizards were still trying to make the lil 303cid both competitive and reliable enough to be sell enough cars to be homologated into the T/A race series...but the engine wasn't up to snuff...and the rule makers of the T/A race series decided to drop the engine homologation requirement (still had to be a production car...just didn't have to have a engine under the 305cid cap)...so what we know as the 1969 Pontiac T/A was the result of that (it too was a mid model year car)...it was just sorta thrown together last minute like so Pontiac could race in the following season... The 303cid motor never really woked right, and Pontiac...under the graces of the T/A race committee...mostly ended up useing the Chevy 302cid engines in thier race cars. finally a response. thanks. I had no idea that the trans am race series effected the development of the car itself. I had heard about the engine incompatability, but that was it. Thanks for the info. THAT is what this thread should be about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSW Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 finally a response.thanks. I had no idea that the trans am race series effected the development of the car itself. I had heard about the engine incompatability, but that was it. Thanks for the info. THAT is what this thread should be about. The father of a friend of mine was one of the engineers working at Pontiac during the time (his contribution to the 2ed gen firebird mainly delt with the brake system)...he died about a decade ago, but he used to tell all sorts of stories about his time there..his real passion was BSA bikes - had a garage full of them... I remember this one story he told concerning the 2ed gen development...IIRC he said it was spring 1969 and they were just getting the new 2ed gen tooling transfered around at the plants...they had a couple of test mules built...the engineering was largely done on the car, but they still had to work out production issues...the test mules were largely just frames built by engineers with a mix of 1st and 2ed gen parts, each built a little different (erm built to established 2ed gen specs, differences being stuff like one would route the wireing different then another, etc...just trying to work out the best way to build them an such)...well the test mules started sliceing up the rubber front brake lines...so they tried to mount them differently...still ended up cutting the brake lines...re-routed them again, and they still got cut...anyway after a few days of this, the problem was solved when it was discovered that the test mules had the wrong inner fender wells (IIRC he said they came from the Chevelle parts bin)...not the fiberglass ones they ended up useing...funny thing is that the fiberglass ones were all ready to go, but due to a clerical error on the build sheet for the test mules they got the wrong inner fenders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddsun1 Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 (edited) IIRC, didn't Pontiac purchase the rights to the "Trans-Am" name from the SCCA? I think I saw that on a History Channel special or something. They had to pay a small royalty on every car w/the T-A name sold (probably pennies on the dollar, but still a sweet deal for the SCCA, I'd bet)? Ah, the glorious 60s and 70s of the Trans-Am. They're still some of the most popular cars at any given vintage race event. I love watching 'em dice it out; the old Donohue Camaros, the Shelby 'Stangs, the big block 'Vettes--still beautiful machines to watch in action. Edited March 23, 2005 by reddsun1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSW Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 IIRC, didn't Pontiac purchase the rights to the "Trans-Am" name from the SCCA? I think I saw that on a History Channel special or something. They had to pay a small royalty on every car w/the T-A name sold (probably pennies on the dollar, but still a sweet deal for the SCCA, I'd bet)? Yes..at the time the plan was to unleash the 2ed gen car in 1969 with the 303cid engine...the GM strike pushed the cars release back to the mid 1970 model year, and the engine never lived up to its potential...Pontiac had licensed the T/A name and so they put together what we know as the 1969 TA inorder to hold the spot open for what became thier 2ed gen basied race cars... From what I remember the 303cid race motors were sorta like the 302cid chevy in that they started with a bigger engine (Pontiac 326 IIRC) and destroked it...Pontiac also lowered the deck hieght, meaning the heads were closer together and a narrower intake manifold had to be fabricated...they also used ram air V heads which required a new camshaft (the valve orders are different...everything up to ram air 4 had E-I-I-E-E-I-I-E intake/exaust valve order like on a small block chevy...ram air 5 are E-I-E-I-E-I-E-I type heads)...from what I remember the engine had oiling and cooling problems and thus got canned...the production 1970.5 T/A was suppost to get a ram air 5 equiped 400cid engine...however, once the T/A race comittee droped the 305cid engine homologation rule for production cars, Pontiac didn't have the bugs worked out of the new heads in time so they got ram air 4 instead. And as Pontiac could compete in TA raceing with canadian built cars equiped with chevy 302cids...and the looming insurance hikes and emission standards that would soon kill the muscle cars...the ram air 5 program got shielved and never saw production. I've got a ton of Pontiac books and stuff up in the attic...the history of the SD program, stuff on the Micky Thompson HEMI heads, etc...If I get the chance I'll try to dig some of it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 I wouldn't say it's an attractive smell exactly, but, much like the smell of racing gas, it's the kinda thing that really hits home in a racer's heart, or however you want to put it. When you drift, the small of good tires starts to become an integral part of the experience. What I mean, though, is that you can tell a good tire by its smell. I want what he's smokin'... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted March 25, 2005 Share Posted March 25, 2005 World's smallest Civic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted March 25, 2005 Share Posted March 25, 2005 (edited) Stole the wheels from this car: Edited March 25, 2005 by peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted March 25, 2005 Share Posted March 25, 2005 Put them on this car: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted March 25, 2005 Share Posted March 25, 2005 Ended up with a near-replica of my car: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted March 25, 2005 Share Posted March 25, 2005 Can you see the little one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 you ricer guys crack me up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowlightman Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 What I mean, though, is that you can tell a good tire by its smell. You just don't stop, do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 Someone change the title of the thread to "Let's trash Commander McBride and everything he says" C'mon guys, leave him alone. Does anyone else here build car models? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander McBride Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 (edited) What I mean, though, is that you can tell a good tire by its smell. You just don't stop, do you? If you're denying it, that's just proof you're full of crap. Anyone who's experienced with drift can easily identify different rubber compsitions by the smell, consitency, and color of the smoke. Edited March 26, 2005 by Commander McBride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 (edited) Does anyone else here build car models? I was into racing Mini-Z's and XRAY M18's for a little while. (thats when I had my Infiniti which had ZERO mods for it. So instead I modded R/C cars! ) Edited March 26, 2005 by Panzer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowlightman Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 Someone change the title of the thread to "Let's trash Commander McBride and everything he says"C'mon guys, leave him alone. Better yet, rename it "Commander MCBride talks out of his ass about cars." Seriously man, I'm not picking on him, I'm picking on the consistently rdiciulous and inane statements he makes. If you're denying it, that's just proof you're full of crap. Anyone who's experienced with drift can easily identify different rubber compsitions by the smell, consitency, and color of the smoke. I bet you can tell how much horsepower a car makes by it's exhaust note too, eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 I used to modify my 1/24 scale model cars too, but that was so long ago and they all look crappy so I won't post any pictures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 (edited) What I mean, though, is that you can tell a good tire by its smell. You just don't stop, do you? If you're denying it, that's just proof you're full of crap. Anyone who's experienced with drift can easily identify different rubber compsitions by the smell, consitency, and color of the smoke. I drifted my NSX by total accident once...scared the *ucking hell out of me. Don't remember the smell of the tires, but detected the faint scent of urine. Edited March 26, 2005 by peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander McBride Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 Someone change the title of the thread to "Let's trash Commander McBride and everything he says"C'mon guys, leave him alone. Better yet, rename it "Commander MCBride talks out of his ass about cars." Seriously man, I'm not picking on him, I'm picking on the consistently rdiciulous and inane statements he makes. If you're denying it, that's just proof you're full of crap. Anyone who's experienced with drift can easily identify different rubber compsitions by the smell, consitency, and color of the smoke. I bet you can tell how much horsepower a car makes by it's exhaust note too, eh? Actually, if you're familliar enough with the car, it'd probably be possible. However, i doubt there's anyone who could do it. However, tires are a totally different story. Different manufacturers use very differing rubber compounds, creating different smoke characteristics. You can easily tell a Dunlop from a Falken from a Yokohama. Even on my own car, I could smell the difference between my ST115s and my ES100s. Different tires have different attributes, as well. Dunlops tend to wear quickly, and produce copious smoke. Falkens provide a sort of middle ground, with moderate wear but light smoke. The Yokohamas tend to smoke little at all, but last the longest. Even the handling differences can be felt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightning Posted March 27, 2005 Share Posted March 27, 2005 Someone change the title of the thread to "Let's trash Commander McBride and everything he says"C'mon guys, leave him alone. Better yet, rename it "Commander MCBride talks out of his ass about cars." Seriously man, I'm not picking on him, I'm picking on the consistently rdiciulous and inane statements he makes. I bet you can tell how much horsepower a car makes by it's exhaust note too, eh? and to borrow a couple emoticons from Dodge-Charger.com..... If you're denying it, that's just proof you're full of crap. Anyone who's experienced with drift can easily identify different rubber compsitions by the smell, consitency, and color of the smoke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightning Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 well....a Cadilliac beat me the other day, it had at least a 350, probably a 502 (late '70's Caddy Coupe DeVille) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stamen0083 Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 Does anyone else here build car models? Yeah. This is my first car model: Can anyone tell what color it really is? Hint: It's not black. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 It looks to me to be Dark Purple. What brand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stamen0083 Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 It's actually TS-55, Tamiya Spray dark blue. The kit is Revell. I went through hell and back to get it to not suck, but even for a first kit, it's still not very good. It looks OK in pictures, but in person... bleh. Spend the money, save the grief, build Tamiya only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 damn dude, thats a KIT??? it looks like a pre-built diecast. I thought thats what it was. nice job on it. thumbs way up. so how come you went with a Spyder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stamen0083 Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 (edited) so how come you went with a Spyder? I like the Spider version better than the Coupe. Mostly because of Need for Speed Hot Pursuit II. See here for more: http://www.uweb.ucsb.edu/~stamen0083/progs/041025/ Looking forward to Tamiya Ferrari F430 Spider kit. PS: Folks, please share your car model pictures. Edited March 30, 2005 by Stamen0083 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Strokesalot Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 tan leather instead of black would have been teh hawtness... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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