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"No details are being revealed about the characters Cabrera and Hurd are playing, but I hear Cabrera will play the pilot of Picard’s ship who also is a skillful thief. Hurd is playing a former intelligence officer who is a brilliant analyst with a terrific memory that has not been affected by her drug and alcohol abuse."

 

STOP SMEARING GRIME ON RODDENBERRY'S NAIVELY IDEALISTIC SHINY UTOPIA.

...

Also, how does theft even make sense in a world with friggin' replicators?

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2 hours ago, JB0 said:

"No details are being revealed about the characters Cabrera and Hurd are playing, but I hear Cabrera will play the pilot of Picard’s ship who also is a skillful thief. Hurd is playing a former intelligence officer who is a brilliant analyst with a terrific memory that has not been affected by her drug and alcohol abuse."

 

STOP SMEARING GRIME ON RODDENBERRY'S NAIVELY IDEALISTIC SHINY UTOPIA.

...

Also, how does theft even make sense in a world with friggin' replicators?

I don't know, ask the dozens of episodes of TNG that involved thieves stealing things like relics and artifacts. Better yet, just ask the Ferengi.

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2 hours ago, JB0 said:

Also, how does theft even make sense in a world with friggin' replicators?

Well, there are obviously some materials that can't be replicated... like dilithium.

Or latinum.  :p

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3 hours ago, JB0 said:

"No details are being revealed about the characters Cabrera and Hurd are playing, but I hear Cabrera will play the pilot of Picard’s ship who also is a skillful thief.

OK, so the captain on Starfleet's very highest horse - a man who spent seven seasons refusing to disembark his moral pedestal - is slumming it with the scum of the universe?

 

Quote

Hurd is playing a former intelligence officer who is a brilliant analyst with a terrific memory that has not been affected by her drug and alcohol abuse."

Seems someone in creative control at CBS forgot that most booze (and all replicated booze) available in the 24th century is made with synthehol, an alcohol substitute that smells and tastes like the real thing but has none of the negative consequences the real thing comes with like debilitating intoxication, alcohol poisoning, or being habit-forming.  How do you have an alcoholic character when the overwhelming majority of booze available is literally abuse-proof?  They'd have to be fairly wealthy to be buying the real deal from somewhere, and you'd think Picard might... y'know... notice or do something if he saw a crewmember on his ship was a lush who buying real alcohol in bulk and getting wasted all the time?

Drug addiction is another issue, since we've at least seen a number of previous 24th century characters who had substance abuse problems for various reasons... though most of those were abusing medical commodities rather than actual narcotics, like Garak's abuse of an endorphen-producing implant and later powerful tranquilizers when the implant broke down.  (There was that laughable almost-PSA by Tasha Yar in TNG's first season about how drugs are bad and that drug addiction in the utopian UFP was almost an alien concept.)

 

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STOP SMEARING GRIME ON RODDENBERRY'S NAIVELY IDEALISTIC SHINY UTOPIA.

I've been saying it since Star Trek: Discovery's first season... this is Star Trek's edgelord phase.  Everything has to be dark, gritty, and depressing.

Discovery's creative staff seems to be snapping out of it, at least.

 

Quote

Also, how does theft even make sense in a world with friggin' replicators?

There are plenty of commodities that cannot be accurately reproduced by a replicator like dilithium, latinum, certain medicines, and so on.  It varies by writer, but it's strongly implied that real restaurants are still a thing in the replicator economy because even high-quality replicators like Quark's still can't reproduce the exact tastes, textures, and aromas of the genuine article and frequently gets written off as inferior to real hand-prepared food made with non-replicated ingredients.1

There are also plenty of things that lose their value when replicated, like original works of art and historical artifacts.  There's still a thriving market for that sort of thing.

 

Just now, technoblue said:

Or starships.

Less so than you'd think... many starship components in the 24th century are fabricted by industrial replicators.

 

1. This was most prevalent in DS9, which occasionally implied that Quark's had an unseen actual kitchen preparing food for people who didn't want replicated.  Abraham Sisko, Ben Sisko, and Michael Eddington all took their fair share of free shots at the perceived lack of quality in replicated food or ingredients.  Abe wrote replicated food off as "slop", Ben had appropriated part of a cargo bay to grow his own ingredients for home cooking, and Eddington carped endlessly about the shortcuts replicators took in reproducing food that made them inferior to the real thing.  Scotty turned up his nose at replicated syntheholic drinks in his TNG appearance as well.  Early TNG was missing this, with that lush from that 20th century group of cryogenic defrostees praising the replicator for making the best martini he'd ever tasted... though I guess it's possible his taste buds were simply clapped out after a lifetime of alcohol abuse.

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5 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Less so than you'd think... many starship components in the 24th century are fabricted by industrial replicators.

My comment was more about whole starships :p and I wasn't implying that it was a common practice just that we do have canon instances where Starfleet property is hijacked/stolen for ulterior motives. Off the top of my head, Galileo II, the USS Reliant, and the USS Enterprise come to mind.

I try to forget about poor Galileo 5.

1 hour ago, Seto Kaiba said:

OK, so the captain on Starfleet's very highest horse - a man who spent seven seasons refusing to disembark his moral pedestal - is slumming it with the scum of the universe?

I'd like to think that Picard was softening up somewhat as his career went on, unless you bring up anything to do with the Borg. Then all diplomacy is off the table. That said, I do agree that the new series will have to give us a good explanation for why he is hanging out with these two new characters. Even with his late-season TNG proclivities, I don't think he would choose to go cruising around the universe willy-nilly with just anybody.

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1 minute ago, technoblue said:

My comment was more about whole starships :p

Well, there is the slightly awkward question of where the USS Voyager kept getting new shuttles of types the ship didn't have when she left spacedock.

Voyager was outfitted with two Type-6 shuttlecraft (TNG late type), but over the course of her trip back to Earth she misplaced something on the order of seventeen warp-capable shuttlecraft.  One Type-6, two Type-8, and 5 Type-9 were confirmed destroyed, type Type-9 were given away, 1 Type-6, 3 Type-8, and 3 Type-9 almost certainly unrecoverable, and one Delta Flyer blown to smithereens.

 

16 minutes ago, technoblue said:

I'd like to think that Picard was softening up somewhat as his career went on, unless you bring up anything to do with the Borg. Then all diplomacy is off the table. That said, I do agree that the new series will have to give us a good explanation for why he is hanging out with these two new characters. Even with his late-season TNG proclivities, I don't think he would choose to go cruising around the universe willy-nilly with just anybody.

We're talking about a man too polite and well-mannered to tell one of his best friends he really only wanted coffee and croissants for breakfast... that's not the sort to go slumming with washed-up substance-abusing intelligence operatives and career criminals.

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4 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

We're talking about a man too polite and well-mannered to tell one of his best friends he really only wanted coffee and croissants for breakfast... that's not the sort to go slumming with washed-up substance-abusing intelligence operatives and career criminals.

He did take a mental beating in the movies. If this is a post TNG/Movie Picard the man might be near cracking. Once this series is done I'll have to check and see if they gave him any Bullockish lines for a proper spit-take.

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We're talking about a man too polite and well-mannered to tell one of his best friends he really only wanted coffee and croissants for breakfast... that's not the sort to go slumming with washed-up substance-abusing intelligence operatives and career criminals.

True, but he also did have a thing for Vash and her sometimes questionable moral compass.

Plus, he's not above giving trouble officers a second chance ala Ro Laren.

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Or that Bajoran woman who was disgraced by the Academy shuttlecraft disaster. 

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He did take a mental beating in the movies. If this is a post TNG/Movie Picard the man might be near cracking.

Granted, Picard did take a licking in the movies... but it was mostly physical, rather than mental, abuse.

Generations was more about beating the hell out of Kirk (and LaForge) with Picard riding in to give Kirk a "what the hell, hero?".  First Contact was a rough trip since the Borg are Jean-Luc Picard's personal berserk button.  Insurrection was a pretty standard "screw the rules, I'm doing what's right" plot.  Nemesis wanted to be psychological abuse for Picard, but it was Troi who took the beating instead once the plot became self-aware enough to notice there was no way Shinzon could relate to Picard at all.

 

 

True, but he also did have a thing for Vash and her sometimes questionable moral compass.

Wasn't that pretty much entirely because she was a fellow archaeologist though?  I recall him being pretty put-off by her casual willingness to engage in dodgy behavior and trying to distance himself from her because of it.

 

 

Plus, he's not above giving trouble officers a second chance ala Ro Laren.

 

Or that Bajoran woman who was disgraced by the Academy shuttlecraft disaster. 

Sito Jaxa's definitely the better example there.

He only permitted Ro Laren on his ship because he was ordered to, and only allowed her to remain after she had already redeemed herself by outing a flag officer's dodgy plan to wipe out a Bajoran resistance group on Cardassia's behalf.

 

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Wasn't that pretty much entirely because she was a fellow archaeologist though?  I recall him being pretty put-off by her casual willingness to engage in dodgy behavior and trying to distance himself from her because of it.

 

Still didn’t stop him from having a little fun with her.

Plus, I’m sure his Q-taught lesson in Tapestry also reminded him that you SHOULDN’T always take the safe route.

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Still didn’t stop him from having a little fun with her.

Plus, I’m sure his Q-taught lesson in Tapestry also reminded him that you SHOULDN’T always take the safe route.

A fair point!

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  • 2 months later...

Hard pass.

The crap Kurtzman is churning out isn't Star Trek and CBS All Access is a garbage service not worth the subscription fee.

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13 minutes ago, derex3592 said:

Damn. If it was on Amazon here I would watch it. Just for Patrick Stewart.  I seriously hope they don't do him a disservice by giving him the Mark Hamill treatment. 

If the word through the grapevine is accurate, it might actually be worse... 

Word is, Kurtzman's story concept for Star Trek: Picard is that Jean-Luc Picard moved on from the USS Enterprise to become head of Section 31.

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uuhhhhhhgggggg......... Jean Luc Picard would never become that. He would be the one to try to demolish Section 31. "The line must be drawn HERE! This far, no further!!!".. Or something to that effect. 

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2 hours ago, UN Spacy said:

Official title and distribution.

 

L

Welp, amazing. I should get new glasses because I swear to the goddess, I saw in that title, "Star Trek Retarded"... 

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23 minutes ago, derex3592 said:

uuhhhhhhgggggg......... Jean Luc Picard would never become that. He would be the one to try to demolish Section 31. "The line must be drawn HERE! This far, no further!!!".. Or something to that effect. 

Yeah, the only writers up to now who dared connect him to anything Section 31-related were the writers who did the Tezwa arc of the Star Trek: the Next Generation relaunch.  The closest he ever got to being involved in Section 31 was unwittingly assisting in a Section 31 operation to cover up President Min Zife's breach of the Khitomer Accords during the Dominion War by forcing him to resign (and then assassinating him).  He was so appalled to learn what he'd unknowingly assisted that he thought he'd gotten off too easy being told his career prospects were now nil.

Jean-Luc Picard was hands-down the most morally upright and least willing to bend the rules... his first instinct if he knew about Section 31 would be to burn it down and salt the land.

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3 minutes ago, sh9000 said:

I want this show to be good but it’s probably going to suck.

A00EB835-F41D-4915-BA90-0ED7DF1BF11C.jpeg.884b067de04b08fd7c0e385f3e52f77c.jpeg

Infinite facepalms in infinite diversity - ancient Vulcan saying.

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9 hours ago, davidwhangchoi said:

when is this releasing?

They've tentatively advertised it as premiering late in 2019.

Whether they'll actually meet that target is questionable, given the difficulties CBS is reportedly having with its other Star Trek plans in the face of having to find new sponsors for the under-development projects Netflix is apparently no longer interested in in light of Star Trek: Discovery's less than stellar reception and the licensee problems they're having over the current Star Trek aesthetic's lack of marketability.

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9 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

They've tentatively advertised it as premiering late in 2019.

Whether they'll actually meet that target is questionable, given the difficulties CBS is reportedly having with its other Star Trek plans in the face of having to find new sponsors for the under-development projects Netflix is apparently no longer interested in in light of Star Trek: Discovery's less than stellar reception and the licensee problems they're having over the current Star Trek aesthetic's lack of marketability.

Thanks Seto

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*impressed whistle*  The bad news just keeps coming.

Reports from the usually-reliable CBS insiders allege that negotiations with the licensees have well and truly broken down, with no takers for the merchandising rights to Star Trek: Picard.  Amazon is also reported to be putting up significantly less money for Star Trek: Picard than Netflix was for Star Trek: Discovery's season one and two in exchange for the international rights to the show, so there'll likely be a sharp dip in the overall quality of the production.

The news that Netflix officially passed on Star Trek: Picard is bad news for Star Trek: Discovery too... CBS has confirmed that they renewed Star Trek: Discovery for a third season, but Netflix hasn't (yet).  The series could see major cutbacks or even be canceled should they decide they're going to scale back their funding of the series or withdraw entirely.  They've got the international rights to the show, so if CBS decides to plow ahead without them they can't distribute outside of the US and Canada.

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Disney:  We took a character in Luke Skywalker and made him do things that are completely opposite of and contrary to what he's demonstrated multiple times in the past.

CBS:  Hold my beer.

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16 hours ago, TangledThorns said:

Wanna fix Star Trek? Make a new series starring Wil Wheaton who re-gained popularity with The Big Bang Theory comedy series.

... oh f*ck no.  

I can't believe I have to say this, but that sounds substantially worse than Star Trek: Discovery.

The Star Trek fandom still largely despises Wesley Crusher.  Even in reruns, ratings clearly show that episodes with Wesley Crusher have significantly lower ratings than those without him.  Wil Wheaton's own stock only rose because he made the hate work for him by candidly admitting that he fully understood why the fans hate Wesley and that he hated Wesley too.  (Even the knowledge that it was Gene Roddenberry's executive meddling that made Wesley a Marty Stu hasn't tempered the fandom's loathing for Wesley.)  Unless something changed recently, the Star Trek fandom doesn't have a lot of use for The Big Bang Theory either given its use of Star Trek fandom as shorthand for being a socially dysfunctional ass.

 

16 hours ago, TangledThorns said:

Have cameos from TNG, DS9 and Voyager series. 

That's expensive, and CBS seems to be rapidly running out of money to keep Star Trek moving between Discovery generating near-zero licensing revenue, Star Trek: Picard drawing a big fat zero from the licensees, and Netflix passing on Star Trek: Picard altogether.

 

16 hours ago, TangledThorns said:

Last, stop the woke crap.

Star Trek was doing woke crap decades before "woke" was even a thing. :lol:

CBS's problem is that they let Star Trek: Discovery prioritize demonstrating how "woke" it was over literally everything else in the show... like creating engaging characters, telling an actual story, etc.  They'd be fine if they'd just stick to the "woke" approach that worked so well for every previous Star Trek show: anvilicious Aesops in allegorical morality plots like TOS's "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield" and "The Omega Glory", TNG's "The Drumhead" and "The Outcast", DS9's "In The Hands of the Prophets" and "Past Tense", VOY's entire schtick with the Maalon, or ENT's Pa'nar syndrome AIDS allegory and "Chosen Realm".

Granted, past Trek has missed as often as it's hit with that kind of Aesop (Voyager mostly missed) but it goes down a lot easier when they're not doing a little victory dance about how progressive they are having a black woman main character while completely forgetting to not make her the worst human being in Star Trek so far who wasn't from the mirror universe.  (That, I swear, was Discovery's one moment of self-awareness... having to go to the mirror universe and dial up its evilness to 11 just so Burnham and co. would seem like a lighter shade of grey, and then have her worry that she's fitting in too well.)

 

6 hours ago, Mog said:

Disney:  We took a character in Luke Skywalker and made him do things that are completely opposite of and contrary to what he's demonstrated multiple times in the past.

CBS:  Hold my beer.

Disney made Skywalker do exactly what the previous generation of Jedi masters did when they screwed up and led the dark side come to power... so it wasn't exactly what you'd call unreasonable or out of character.  (They weren't terribly subtle about it either, bringing Yoda along to chastise him for stealing his bit.)

What CBS has done to Star Trek is way, WAY worse... they took a high-concept intellectual sci-fi series in which humanity had transcended such petty things as racism, sexism, and petty warmongering and turned it into a lowbrow action series about a racist warmonger and garnished it with huge helpings of misandry.

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2 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Disney made Skywalker do exactly what the previous generation of Jedi masters did when they screwed up and led the dark side come to power... so it wasn't exactly what you'd call unreasonable or out of character.  (They weren't terribly subtle about it either, bringing Yoda along to chastise him for stealing his bit.)

What CBS has done to Star Trek is way, WAY worse... they took a high-concept intellectual sci-fi series in which humanity had transcended such petty things as racism, sexism, and petty warmongering and turned it into a lowbrow action series about a racist warmonger and garnished it with huge helpings of misandry.

I’m actually making a comparison between Luke and Picard, specifically their recent or planned treatments given what we already know.

But I have to disagree on your take about Luke.

As I’ve said numerous times, Luke’s always been the guy to leap up whenever people (especially his friends) are in trouble, consequences be damned.  He did it when he realized Owen and Beru were in danger, he did it when he rescued Leia, he did it when he jumped into an X-Wing to take on a Death Star, he did it when he flew off to Bespin despite Yoda’s warnings, he did it when he didn’t wallow in self-pity and came up with plans to rescue Han from Jabba, and he did it when he volunteered for the Endor strike team without thinking it through.

Yes, other Jedi Masters failed royally.  But Yoda and Obi played the long game after their respective failures.  What was Luke’s excuse for hiding away?

Yeah, Luke screwed up during his moment of weakness with Kylo.  But how was it any worse than ignoring Yoda and Obi’s warnings, getting his ass handed to him, and finding out Mr. Embodiment of Dark Side Evil is your daddy?

Again, I don’t mind Luke failing, but I disagree with how they ignored all of his previous, well-established character traits.

Which seems to be exactly what’s happening here, with Picard running Section 31.  It absolutely flies in the face of everything we know about the man.

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  • azrael changed the title to Star Trek: Picard (CBS All-Access)

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