Dobber Posted December 26, 2017 Share Posted December 26, 2017 Awe crap! Stupid auto correct! Lol Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 Watching it for a third time tomorrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajnrig Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 (edited) https://www.usatoday.com/story/life/movies/2017/12/26/mark-hamill-regrets-criticizing-luke-skywalkers-character-last-jedi/983326001/ Haven't had a chance to read it yet, but I wonder if his supposed regrets have less to do with their content and more with the reaction to them. I've seen them as just kind of honest expressions of conflicting feelings, but I know others have twisted them into a dig at the movie and the new trilogy as a whole. Edit: Eh, turned out to be more mundane than I thought. Seems he was just upset he expressed himself so publicly. I can appreciate that sentiment. I can also appreciate that he did make it public. Eh. Edited December 27, 2017 by kajnrig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azrael Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 On 12/25/2017 at 7:46 PM, Kanedas Bike said: But see, she's not a Force wielding genius, it's more like brute strength. So what she moved some rocks and grabbed a Light Saber? She's was shown to have some hand-to-hand fighting aptitude when she knocked Finn on his ass in TFA. She didn't Reveal hidden contents resist Snoke, and he handled her with ease. From force movement, to lighting to being able to read her thoughts/feelings. If she was you write, she'd have had some success against him. She. Had. None. In that alone it shows she needs instruction. She's like a brute force attacker vs. being elegant or skilled. Staff and Light Saber skill notwithstanding. If she is raw power, then... moving and clearing a path of those rocks and boulders should have been much more messy for someone who just found out they could do that a day ago. Considering she nearly caused an earthquake a day earlier by feeling the Force and Luke had trouble snapping her out of that. Then she nicely moves the rocks and parts it like the Dead Sea the next day. Either she's a extremely fast learner or it's piss poor writing. Everything we've seen have shown us that it takes time to learn these skills and Rey picks it up a day later after she found out she could even do these things the day prior. If Rey is untamed power, I don't really see that when she is put into those situations. It's like "snap your fingers and she's as good as Yoda." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azrael Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 3 hours ago, kajnrig said: https://www.usatoday.com/story/life/movies/2017/12/26/mark-hamill-regrets-criticizing-luke-skywalkers-character-last-jedi/983326001/ Haven't had a chance to read it yet, but I wonder if his supposed regrets have less to do with their content and more with the reaction to them. I've seen them as just kind of honest expressions of conflicting feelings, but I know others have twisted them into a dig at the movie and the new trilogy as a whole. Edit: Eh, turned out to be more mundane than I thought. Seems he was just upset he expressed himself so publicly. I can appreciate that sentiment. I can also appreciate that he did make it public. Eh. Or Disney said "Silence you!". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajnrig Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 14 minutes ago, azrael said: Or Disney said "Silence you!". Yeah, but his character is dead. What's Disney gonna do? "Digitally replace him with Hayden Chris--" OKAY OKAY YOU WIN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajnrig Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 17 minutes ago, azrael said: Either she's a extremely fast learner or it's piss poor writing. Everything we've seen have shown us that it takes time to learn these skills and Rey picks it up a day later after she found out she could even do these things the day prior. If Rey is untamed power, I don't really see that when she is put into those situations. It's like "snap your fingers and she's as good as Yoda." Could be column A, column B, or column C: eh, handwave it. It certainly FEELS like she's on that island for an appropriately long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renegadeleader1 Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 This Mark Hamill thing reminds me of what happened to Shia Lebouf and The Crystal Skull. He was open about his distaste for it and was basically warned to shut up or else by Harrison Ford of all people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh9000 Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 I wonder how much screen time he’ll have in the next one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanedas Bike Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 6 hours ago, azrael said: If she is raw power, then... Reveal hidden contents moving and clearing a path of those rocks and boulders should have been much more messy for someone who just found out they could do that a day ago. Considering she nearly caused an earthquake a day earlier by feeling the Force and Luke had trouble snapping her out of that. Then she nicely moves the rocks and parts it like the Dead Sea the next day. Either she's a extremely fast learner or it's piss poor writing. Everything we've seen have shown us that it takes time to learn these skills and Rey picks it up a day later after she found out she could even do these things the day prior. If Rey is untamed power, I don't really see that when she is put into those situations. It's like "snap your fingers and she's as good as Yoda." With respect you're only focusing on the parts you really don't like i.e. what she's been successful at versus where she's failed (like the example I laid out where for all of her ability she was quit handily beaten and helpless). So, we'll agree to disagree. Re: Hamill, he's not young actor or some nobody, he'll get just as much screen time as he was always going to get in IX. Going back to clarify or make a statement simplye means that he's a professional, he didn't like some of the direction Rian took with Luke. And I believe him when he said even with the creative differences he still things TLJ was a good movie that pushes the boundaries of what people "think" Star Wars is and should be now versus what it was. -b. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Focslain Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 (edited) So saw this over the weekend, final thoughts it was meh. Not as good as the OT but better then TPM. The bomber sequence angered me more then I thought it would. I mean why were those things even designed, the B-Wing was designed to do what they were and do it 100x better and it's a 30 year old design. I did like the send off they gave Luke, for all I heard about Hamill not liking the direction of the character he had a good final bout. A lot can happen in 30 years and if we got some context to his change between RoJ and TLJ it might have been better. With that it was also the only reason I didn't call massive BS on Leia surviving being spaced. I'm sure Luke gave her some training between movies, but that scene reeked of Ex Machina.[/spoilers] Also I hope that we get something saying Poe is force-sensitive, cause I'm called BS if he isn't after the stunts he pulled in this film, TFA and betting he'll pull in the next one. Edited December 27, 2017 by Focslain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajnrig Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 http://www.slashfilm.com/the-morning-watch-dunkirk-compared-to-real-history-ghost-in-the-shell-featurette-more/ Tangentially related is this page that Google recommended. The SW part is a time-lapse build of the Death Star, but more interesting to me are the Dunkirk and GitS videos - the former comparing it to archival footage and the latter being a look at Weta's special effects work (for which apparently the movie has been nominated for an Oscar). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh9000 Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 This was in my feed on youtube. I like the part where she caught the football. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajnrig Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 (edited) http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-42492807 Quote Alfie Curtis, who played Dr Evazan in Star Wars: A New Hope, has died at the age of 87. The London-born actor had also appeared in the 1980 film The Elephant Man and the 80s UK TV series Cribb. His Star Wars character famously threatened Luke Skywalker at Mos Eisley Cantina in the first of the original trilogy in 1977, telling him: "I have the death sentence on 12 systems". EDIT: Also this: Mark Hamill Pays Tribute to Carrie Fisher One Year After Her Death: 'No One's Ever Really Gone' Edited December 27, 2017 by kajnrig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Valkyrie Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scyla Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 (edited) Saw the movie today. It was a confusing experience. I have to think about it some more. There is the real possibility that I‘m not a Star Wars fan any longer. What is the consensus on MW? Edited December 27, 2017 by Scyla Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajnrig Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 6 minutes ago, Scyla said: Saw the movie today. It was a confusing experience. I have to think about it some more. There is the real possibility that I‘m not a Star Wars fan any longer. What is the consensus on MW? Generally the same, with people falling on either side of that possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hikaru Ichijo SL Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 I really did not like this movie that much and a OT fan leaves mean wondering. That all the progress of the Rebellion in 4,5 and 6 has basically been wiped out in the last 2 movies and the First Order (Empire) is back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArchieNov Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 On 12/25/2017 at 1:16 PM, slaginpit said: I loved this summary of the movie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommar Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 9 hours ago, Kanedas Bike said: With respect you're only focusing on the parts you really don't like i.e. what she's been successful at versus where she's failed (like the example I laid out where for all of her ability she was quit handily beaten and helpless). Out of two movies your example is the single, solitary time she actually failed at anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoryHolmes Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 36 minutes ago, Hikaru Ichijo SL said: I really did not like this movie that much and a OT fan leaves mean wondering. That all the progress of the Rebellion in 4,5 and 6 has basically been wiped out in the last 2 movies and the First Order (Empire) is back. That's my take on the matter as well. Total reset, back to the beginning. Dominating Empire, check. Solitary partially-trained Jedi, check. Better-trained villain tempting the hero(ine) to turn to the Dark Side, check. Death of older, wiser, more experienced mentor, check. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenius Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 1 hour ago, ArchieNov said: I loved this summary of the movie That was entertaining but I'm afraid almost all Star Wars films fall apart with scrutiny (there are great takedowns of the prequel trilogy that should be required viewing among the new film makers). Sleeping in a dead animal won't keep you warm and a personnel carrier that can be tripped is silly... And that's not even touching ewoks. The slow chase was awful though and really did involve a whole lot of brain shutting off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobber Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 If they really wanted to try something different, they should’ve shown the New Republic being bogged down by bureaucracy and corruption with little being accomplished anymore. More and more systems are becoming disenfranchised with the ineptness of the government and are being “courted” by an former Imperial faction, the “First Order”, that is apparently prospering and growing. Leia see’s the danger the First Order represents, but the corruption and ineptitude of the New Republic is making the apparent strength of the FO’s government a very tempting proposition for many. Basically, turn everything on its head. Instead of having a Rebellion growing out of an evil Empire, again, do the opposite and show more people going to a more seemingly strong/ driven, yet tyrannical, government due to inaction and infighting of a indecisive Republic. Instead of being just “black and white” good/evil, show why some people would join an Empire and/or fight with them. The FO could still be evil, but show the problems of the New Republic as well. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenius Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 I don't know... Most people didn't seem too thrilled with bureaucracy taking front stage in the prequels, I think that's a big part of why the new trilogy has basically not touched on it to the detriment of the stories. We don't even understand what the republic was at this point. The Empire was just bad in the OT and we didn't need to learn a lot about why it was bad... I suspect these filmmakers want to return to that simple backdrop. The good guys were just good... Until Lando. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mog Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 26 minutes ago, Dobber said: If they really wanted to try something different, they should’ve shown the New Republic being bogged down by bureaucracy and corruption with little being accomplished anymore. More and more systems are becoming disenfranchised with the ineptness of the government and are being “courted” by an former Imperial faction, the “First Order”, that is apparently prospering and growing. Leia see’s the danger the First Order represents, but the corruption and ineptitude of the New Republic is making the apparent strength of the FO’s government a very tempting proposition for many. Basically, turn everything on its head. Instead of having a Rebellion growing out of an evil Empire, again, do the opposite and show more people going to a more seemingly strong/ driven, yet tyrannical, government due to inaction and infighting of a indecisive Republic. Instead of being just “black and white” good/evil, show why some people would join an Empire and/or fight with them. The FO could still be evil, but show the problems of the New Republic as well. Chris I wouldn't mind this idea. Part of the problem I have with the Sequel Trilogy is that it's just a re-hash of Empire vs. Rebels. Even folks on these boards get mixed up and refer to the First Order as the Empire or the Resistance as the Rebels. Part of the problem with the ST is that they haven't built up the current universe/situation enough in the movies. Why doesn't the New Republic/Galactic Alliance/whatever the heck they're called just curb-stomp the FO? Did that Starkiller shot wipe out the New Republic and all of their feet? Talk all the smack you want about the prequels. But if that Starkiller strike had hit Coruscant instead (rather than some no-name planet system we never heard of before in the movies), that would have had a hell of a lot more impact. But alas, we're asked to just accept that it's over-powered Empire vs. rag-tag Rebels all over again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TangledThorns Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 I'd say the big mistake Disney made was hiring JJ Abrams when he turned it down more than once... till Disney flashed a boat load of money to him. They should have brought on a hungry director to take it on, a Peter Jackson type, before The Hobbit of course Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronocidal Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 (edited) That's really the biggest failing I think of the franchise as a whole lately. They've thrown so much necessary backstory out of the movies and into other stuff like novels and comics, there's no context for what's going on. At least with ANH, you had the conference room scenes and vague political exposition about how the Emperor had dissolved the Senate, but there's absolutely no explanation for anything going on. I thought the First Order was a radical fringe faction hiding in the background of legitimate remaining Imperial holdings, and the "Resistance" was a similar underground movement formed because the Republic wouldn't move against the First Order. See, funny thing. I've seen this plot fairly recently, in Guardians of the Galaxy Vol.1. The rogue warlord out for vengeance couldn't accept the treaty, and went out of his way to wipe out the people his people used to be fighting, but the Kree weren't going to stop Ronan either. Except in TFA, the First Order basically won. The part I cannot even remotely comprehend is how in the space of the five minutes between the two movies we literally went from "The First Order has been defeated, and lost their main base/superweapon!" to "The First Order has taken over the galaxy!" Seriously, WTF. Two things about the plot make themselves apparent upon watching. First off, it would seem that the ENTIRE FIRST ORDER FLEET was chasing that single Resistance cruiser. That's the only even remotely plausible explanation I can come up with for why they didn't bring other ships in to attack them from the front and end the stupid chase sequence. Second.. Apparently the entire freaking galaxy is entirely okay with falling under Imperial rule again. Again, WTF. But then, even that doesn't make any sense.. if they had enough troops to retake the entire galaxy, they probably would have had more ships to jump in and obliterate the Resistance. And if their entire fleet really is chasing that one cruiser, then how is the entire galaxy under First Order rule? Or is the rest of the First Order fleet busy conquering the galaxy in the background? Nobody knows! We've never heard one way or another about literally any other planet in the Galaxy, so we have no idea what anyone else is doing. Are they all surrendering? Are they all rebelling? After killing off the entire New Republic in one shot on TFA, the entirety of the First Order leadership has had nothing better to do than hunt down the remaining ships in the Resistance, so are we supposed to assume that the entire galaxy surrendered? Sorry, I'm just rambling here, but I'm honestly curious, because I haven't felt like reading the novelizations that explain all the stuff left out of the movies. Edited December 28, 2017 by Chronocidal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eXis10z Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 (edited) 18 hours ago, kajnrig said: Yeah, but his character is dead. What's Disney gonna do? "Digitally replace him with Hayden Chris--" OKAY OKAY YOU WIN Given Disney's clout I won't be surprised if they can have him black listed from any sort of work. Edited December 28, 2017 by eXis10z Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanedas Bike Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 7 hours ago, Mommar said: Out of two movies your example is the single, solitary time she actually failed at anything. Except in TFA when Kylo Force held her in the forest, or when she had the meltdown when she first encountered the Light Saber or when Kylo knocked her into a tree or when she opened the wrong doors on Solo's freighter. So...yeah...didn't you swear off Star Wars a page or two ago? There are some legit gripes that anyone, fan of the new trilogy or not, can and should have with these movies. I just can't understand why Rey being good at things is one of them. Would y'all prefer a training montage to help sooth your pain? But a lot of the posts I see ad nauseam in this thread is pure unadulterated butt-hurt because these either aren't the OT or are too much like the OT (it's still hard for me to figure out what the most vocal detractors actually want - because it's just a bunch of negative noise at this point). And sorry to break it to the folks living in a nostalgia-induced state of euphoria, the OT didn't contain 3 cinematic masterpieces, Star Wars was cool because it was something we hadn't seen before, The Empire Strikes Back was pretty bad-ass and Return of the Jedi borderline sucked. P.S. Porgs and Ice Foxes > Ewoks -b. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Focslain Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 Think my biggest issue with the new trilogy is that it's feeling like a bad attempt to soft re-boot the SW series. I'm hoping that IX recovers the franchise cause SW is nearing DCEU levels of lost potential. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slaginpit Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 I like how people crap and call people names that say this movie sucks. Take away the label Star Wars. And call it Space Hero Superheros I don't care. its a shitty movie. Pacing. Bad Acting, continuity. Period. I never knew anything about Guardians. Was it an outstanding movie. No, but it went from A to b and then c and because of that I was able to relate to characters I didn't have a clue about. There was no set up prior to that movie, of course it referenced the comics but you can only do so much in 1.5 hours This movie went from Z to G to A to B then back to Z and back to D. Its a mess. Was it necessary and keeping in mind you take away the name luke and lets call him old fart, to have him milk titties from an animal that looked it was like getting some pleasure from it and that odd face it does and look it gives to Msue and to have Msue turn around as if some animal fornication were at play only to have old fart give that look, mmmm fresh titty juice....Come on! However yet they are referencing events to the star wars universe and because of that its out of place. So you cant even treat it as a standalone because of its a sequel to FA. And because of that its even more disjointed and ludicrous. And because its a sequel to the first SW trilogy its even more ludicrous! Also it sheats on men ie purple haired Anita Sarkessian shouting down to practically a war hero that destroyed Death Snow Globe 3.0 and what seemed was your only one ace pilot. If I was him i would be like, "you know what your right, im just some stupid hot jock ace pilot, you dont need me. you'll be fine. Boys you coming with me? " gets in their fighters and fly away to safety or heck even join the empire 2.0. What the hell! I mean it isnt a surprise that no one came to help them for their plea to action...Duh! Dumb 2017 comedy Verizon references in a future where space ships can warp and ultimate AI robots Shits on Father figures. Han a war hero and former general just lazily forgotten in the FA and basically one of the "fly Boys" that aided ONCE AGAIN in the destruction of snow globe 3.0 and not one memorial scene? Again aside from SWs and stuff, it seemed just wrong to introduce a character in FA to only kill off i guess because he was an old white guy. We see how mary Poppins was oogled over. Even mary poppins didnt seem to care much. No one bothered to ask if luke was ok. "he guys we made it!" everyone is here? what about that old white guy that made us escape?" nope! Old Grumpy White fart=expendable. Oh and the only jedi people oogled over. But hey Msue can move rocks. Um maybe move one those at at's and make them keel over on top each other like dominos. I mean it would fitting. Just add another one of those WHA WHAAAAA moments If I were luke, "Han is dead?" was there a memorial service, how is my sister taking it." Msue"naw we just forgot about him, your sister doesnt even talk about him" Luke," oh well then I guess you guys have it taken care off, you dont need me. Im just a guy"! what a disaster for Disney, a disaster for some rian guy, a disaster for "the Force is feminism" Kennedy. There is even a rumor floating around that the han movie=Not interested in it at all or anything with SW attached to it, that the guy chosen for han cant act and has been already red lined in the Disney accounting books. This is what happens in the ecomomic stages of capitalism -Monopolies are created, product suffers and cronyism grows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenius Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 You can only do so much with linear and simple plots but that is certainly ANH. The problem for these movies is that the universe has grown too huge. Look at all the people in this thread pissed about the treatment of OT characters. It's hard to make a movie about new characters when your audience wants a continuation story that doesn't need to be made. So, we get two movies at the same time, one for the new characters, one with the old characters, and people unsatisfied with both. Fortunately for the next film, the OT characters are mostly departed. The feminism stuff sounds stupid to me. If a guy told Poe off and acted like that woman did, I don't think anyone would care. Since she's a woman people cry feminism. How many other movies have we watched bad male officers in and been like 'meh, that guy sucks' and left it at that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Focker Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 Another video review. Overall they were positive about the movie but did draw plenty attention to its many flaws. And a few days after seeing the movie my feelings are mixed. I understand characters and in universe rules from the OT had to change for this new universe to work. There were many parts from this movie that I liked. But that script was a mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azrael Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 16 hours ago, jenius said: I don't know... Most people didn't seem too thrilled with bureaucracy taking front stage in the prequels, I think that's a big part of why the new trilogy has basically not touched on it to the detriment of the stories. We don't even understand what the republic was at this point. The Empire was just bad in the OT and we didn't need to learn a lot about why it was bad... I suspect these filmmakers want to return to that simple backdrop. The good guys were just good... Until Lando. Bureaucracy in a story can work if presented correctly. The prequels tried to do it but it ended up being (It worked by ROS, but it took 3 movies to get there.) 16 hours ago, Chronocidal said: That's really the biggest failing I think of the franchise as a whole lately. They've thrown so much necessary backstory out of the movies and into other stuff like novels and comics, there's no context for what's going on. If I have to read side materials or stories, you've lost me. I shouldn't have to read side material just to watch a movie. Present it in the movie or don't do it. 17 hours ago, Dobber said: If they really wanted to try something different, they should’ve shown the New Republic being bogged down by bureaucracy and corruption with little being accomplished anymore. More and more systems are becoming disenfranchised with the ineptness of the government and are being “courted” by an former Imperial faction, the “First Order”, that is apparently prospering and growing. Leia see’s the danger the First Order represents, but the corruption and ineptitude of the New Republic is making the apparent strength of the FO’s government a very tempting proposition for many. Basically, turn everything on its head. Instead of having a Rebellion growing out of an evil Empire, again, do the opposite and show more people going to a more seemingly strong/ driven, yet tyrannical, government due to inaction and infighting of a indecisive Republic. Instead of being just “black and white” good/evil, show why some people would join an Empire and/or fight with them. The FO could still be evil, but show the problems of the New Republic as well. That's what happened with the prequel trilogy, to some effect. Worlds were leaving the Republic and joining the Separatists movement because of government inaction, infighting, lack of representation, etc. which eventually led to the Clone Wars. Back in the prequels, Sidious/Palpatine preyed on the insecurities of worlds to get them to dissolve the Republic. Your twist could be that this is happening without a Sith Lord interfering with the Republic and yet people are flowing to strong yet tyrannical rule. But, again, it has to be presented correctly or the audience won't go with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsu legato Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 I can honestly say that I feel like I'm done with Star Wars. So long and thanks for all the Porgs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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