Totoro242 Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 I wanted to discuss something regarding the Blacklist thread that has been eating at me as of late. I want to start by stating my perceptions of what the Blacklist thread is and how it should be used. Maybe this is where some of you will disagree. The Blacklist is place for members to air grievances regarding the business conduct on MW or related to MW members. Members often add a name to the list with a brief description of the issue and the Blacklist is updated. Every once in a while, it is also used to "call someone out" on the board and this leads to a public discussion between the two members. Usually the intent here is to use the thread as a tool to gain some sort of result i.e.; "if you aren't going to follow through to my satisfaction, I will let the whole world know". I think this is just fine. Other members may chime in because they have had similar experiences with a member, which is also great. Their involvement helps move the issue along. Mostly, its a great thread. I keep up with it as often as I can because I conduct a lot of business on MW. Here is what bothers me. Why do members feel so inclined to believe that someone else's issue invites their commentary and involvement, though they have never been involved what-so-ever in the controversial transaction? Inevitably, this "butting in" leads to further retaliatory comments by the involved parties, inviting more retorts and hard feelings, insert downward spiral, etc. What we end up with is a headache of juvenial comments to wade through just to get real issues. It detracts from the overall importance of the posts by filling the thread with what is essentially spam. How about we keep the posts in the MW Blacklist to those involved in an issue directly or indirectly? Am I asking too much by requesting that everyone take this into consideration before posting in the thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EXO Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 I approve this post! Another thing that bugs me is members that comment in for sale threads that have no intention of buying it, turning it into a discussion thread. The Sale and Trade sections are not discussion threads, it's a section for business. Unless you want to conduct business or if you have proof of bad dealings. If the price is not for you, then don't post on the thread, PM an offer. If it doesn't sell then the thread will die on it's own. No need to bump it up for the seller with no intention of buying. If you want to speculate on prices, do it in the appropriate section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr March Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 Are we allowed to chime in on this topic? Seriously though, isn't participation (good or bad) one of the trade offs of public hearings? Open forums and public discussion all sounds very nice and progressive, but people in groups have a really nasty tendency to wind themselves up into witch hunts. The advantage of the public forum is feedback from others, but the disadvantages are people will post crap that need not be posted. Public debates are also entertaining, so they will draw crowds. I hope your request does some good, but human nature is a tough nut to crack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EXO Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 I think it's less complicated than having to do with human nature as it does with just nosy people just S'ingTFU... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kicker773 Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 I approve this post! Another thing that bugs me is members that comment in for sale threads that have no intention of buying it, turning it into a discussion thread. The Sale and Trade sections are not discussion threads, it's a section for business. Unless you want to conduct business or if you have proof of bad dealings. If the price is not for you, then don't post on the thread, PM an offer. If it doesn't sell then the thread will die on it's own. No need to bump it up for the seller with no intention of buying. If you want to speculate on prices, do it in the appropriate section. I 2nd that this comment. I've had two items I had for sale if remembering correctly which was a for sale thread that turned into a "discussion thread on why my asking price wasn't fit for them". Seriously, c'mon if your not going to buy or offer, move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totoro242 Posted May 29, 2009 Author Share Posted May 29, 2009 Another thing that bugs me is members that comment in for sale threads that have no intention of buying it, turning it into a discussion thread. The Sale and Trade sections are not discussion threads, it's a section for business. Unless you want to conduct business or if you have proof of bad dealings. If the price is not for you, then don't post on the thread, PM an offer. If it doesn't sell then the thread will die on it's own. No need to bump it up for the seller with no intention of buying. If you want to speculate on prices, do it in the appropriate section. I wholeheartedly agree. I had actually intended this as a dual topic, with this other point second, but I didn't want to overwhelm this topic with my endless prattle. Well, anymore than I already have. Since its out there now, my specific issue is similar to the first point; when it comes to For Sale And Trade threads, why do members feel so inclined to believe that someone else's sale invites their commentary and involvement, even though they have no intention what-so-ever in purchasing the item/items? I find it rather poor form to make unsolicited comments in a for sale thread. It can actually hurt a sale by filling it with spam and negative comments. I'm not advocating censorship here, just common sense. How about we say that anywhere on the board is fair game for open comments and opinions (within reason), but the For Sale And Trade section maybe should be treated with more respect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenius Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 I'm on board with all of this... generally I think MW has a better proportion of civil and intelligent members than most other corners of the Interweb but it seems the BL and FS/T posts often make people forget their better judgment. If an item in the FS/T section is too expensive for you to buy and the seller doesn't mention taking offers than accept it's too expensive and move on, don't b*tch about the price. The BL got so crappy at one point I gave up on it. Comments like "Oh man, if someone did that to me I'd punchisize their face!" left too much comment spam for me to sort through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFTF1 Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 You guys remember the scene in Borat where he comes into the hotel in NYC, and the clerk is like: "Ok, that'll be 150 a night." and Borat spits in his hand, and extends it and says: "80!" The mods just need to give a week long custom sig of Borat to anybody who does that in the for sale threads and problem solved Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiriyu Posted May 30, 2009 Share Posted May 30, 2009 Totoro and EXO are right. I've been guilty of posting unnecessarily in both circumstances noted, and very recently too. It is disruptive behaviour. I'm sorry for that, and will not do it again. Thanks guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent ONE Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 I enjoy the comments from the peanut gallery. Usually its chumps that want attention, but still fun. Kinda like Jerry Springer. I love the mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Focker Posted May 31, 2009 Share Posted May 31, 2009 I got nothing with comments as long as they are relevant. Sure as seller you can worry that someone might ruin your sale. Think about buyers are all of them well informed? As a buyer are you always well informed. If other members spot something relevant about a sale don't you want to know what it it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EXO Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Relevance is fine especially if something seems dubious... but we're getting advice like "maybe you shouldn't be selling at this current market" to douchebags saying "That's never gonna happen." I'd rather if people generally stay out of other people's for sale thread unless it's VERY relevant as compared to MILDLY relevant. And a lot of people here probably has no proper gauge of that so they should really just stay out of it altogether. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dangard Ace Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Sales threads: Are you the seller or are you buying(at the sellers price)? If not stay the f out of it. The ONLY time you should be thread crapping is if the item is misrepresented or the seller is selling WAY out of market pricing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godzilla Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Relevance is fine especially if something seems dubious... but we're getting advice like "maybe you shouldn't be selling at this current market" to douchebags saying "That's never gonna happen." I'd rather if people generally stay out of other people's for sale thread unless it's VERY relevant as compared to MILDLY relevant. And a lot of people here probably has no proper gauge of that so they should really just stay out of it altogether. Frankly, I think it is one person doing that kind of crap which therefore incites a discussion. IMHO, he should be banned for a week or so to be taught a lesson. There are many times I wanted to tell him to STFU in those for sale threads but I decided to stay out of it unless I was intending to buy. If I responded, it only makes it worse IMHO. I mean come on. Comments like "Dude, why are you selling?" or "maybe you shouldn't be selling at this current market" really irk me. To me: 1. None of your DAMN business. 2. Stop detracting from the thread. 3. STFU as you have no f-ing clue to what you are saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacrossMan Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 ...when it comes to For Sale And Trade threads, why do members feel so inclined to believe that someone else's sale invites their commentary and involvement, even though they have no intention what-so-ever in purchasing the item/items? I find it rather poor form to make unsolicited comments in a for sale thread. It can actually hurt a sale by filling it with spam and negative comments. I'm not advocating censorship here, just common sense. How about we say that anywhere on the board is fair game for open comments and opinions (within reason), but the For Sale And Trade section maybe should be treated with more respect. I'm guilty of posting comments in for sale threads recently. My unsolicited comments on two occasions have centered on trying to get the seller to re-think selling an item unless they absolutely have to because most items are not selling for what they did 12 months ago. Totoro242’s comments make the most sense and should be the general rule for not posting comments in a for sale thread. I got nothing with comments as long as they are relevant. I sent the following reply after receiving a PM from a mod regarding posting comments in for sale threads: I posted a comment because the seller seemed to be looking for advice when he stated he had been out of the loop on the value of the toys and wanted any info on the current values. In this case, should those comments be made in PM as well? Certainly not trying to piss on anyone's sale, but do understand how the comments might be a distraction. I'll keep advice and opinions in PM in the future; particularly when the seller is not seeking them. Again, thanks for the heads up. MM I did not receive an answer regarding posting comments when the seller solicits them and do not want to be wrong in assuming it is okay to post comments if the seller solicits advice. At the same time I do not want to do anything that appears I'm stepping on toes after a warning. Since this issue is being discussed in an open forum can a mod provide some clarification? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EXO Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 A seller shouldn't solicit comments from people about their product. If he wants to know about a certain toy (within the realm of MW interests) then he should start a thread in the appropriate forum. But he should also know that it's possible that some people are going to lowball him/her to get the price they want. Just so you know Macrossman. I sent out that warning to different people so don't feel singled out by me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacrossMan Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 A seller shouldn't solicit comments from people about their product. If he wants to know about a certain toy (within the realm of MW interests) then he should start a thread in the appropriate forum. But he should also know that it's possible that some people are going to lowball him/her to get the price they want. Just so you know Macrossman. I sent out that warning to different people so don't feel singled out by me. Cool deal. No hard feelings; I was guilty and appreciated the heads up and didn't feel sigled out. Just wanted clarification for when sellers solicit comments. Hopefully those threads will be posted in the right place in the future for members to post their comments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharky Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Here is what bothers me. Why do members feel so inclined to believe that someone else's issue invites their commentary and involvement, though they have never been involved what-so-ever in the controversial transaction? Inevitably, this "butting in" leads to further retaliatory comments by the involved parties, inviting more retorts and hard feelings, insert downward spiral, etc. What we end up with is a headache of juvenial comments to wade through just to get real issues. It detracts from the overall importance of the posts by filling the thread with what is essentially spam. How about we keep the posts in the MW Blacklist to those involved in an issue directly or indirectly? I see your point. I think the reason people want to add comments, at least for me, is that it has to do with trying to stick up for the guy that was wronged. I am guilty of chiming in on the blacklist thread. In my example I felt so bad for Save since he is such a great MW member and has been very kind to everyone here. I think it was only natural for some people, myself included, to rally around him by condemning the guy he had a problem with. In my example I was trying to point out the fallacy of the guy's logic and why it didn't justify his actions toward Save. In retrospect it is probably best to simply let the two parties involved work it out. As you mentioned, things could easily get out of hand with a mob mentality and all. I'll make it a point to stay out of the blacklist thread unless I am directly involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EXO Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 ok well... I'm glad we're all in agreement... blank slate for everyone! Blacklist and for sale threads.... as far as conversations, NOT blacklisted no gooders! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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