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I joined there last month...time to check in that thread there!!

Edited by Gaijin

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Life imitating art or art imitating life... This is a message board dedicated to Macross in which we have a thread about weapons... and THIS is a firearms board that has a thread about Macross.

Macross invades AR15.com.

Any ARFcommers here should chime in to be counted. I already gave them a link to the main site to see if we can recruit some more gun toting Macross fans. :ph34r::p

Cdr Fokker and I are already there, who else?

ALLANJ checking in.

Arfcom taking over. :D

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Yep, I was over there regularly, but lately I've kinda dropped that hobby.

I bought a brand new M1A SOCOM 16 and then spent another $1000 tricking it out only to find out it's a dud.

I sent it back to the factory and they didn't fix poo and sent it back, I haven't even tested it out.

The whole thing really bummed me out so I just dropped the hobby, haven't been shooting in a couple months.

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I've heard nothing but horror stories about all the new Springer M1As since they ran out of original milspec parts. Supposedly their new parts they make themselves are cheap cast pot metal junk... too bad really as I wanted to get a NM M1A, now I'm stuck looking for a used "preban" one that has good quality US MIL parts in it. It's a sad day when a Chinese Polytech M14 has better out of the box quality than an American made M1A.

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Yep, I was over there regularly, but lately I've kinda dropped that hobby.

I bought a brand new M1A SOCOM 16 and then spent another $1000 tricking it out only to find out it's a dud.

I sent it back to the factory and they didn't fix poo and sent it back, I haven't even tested it out.

The whole thing really bummed me out so I just dropped the hobby, haven't been shooting in a couple months.

What was wrong with it? And...you didn't shoot it first to see how it was before "tricking" it out? :blink:

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I've heard nothing but horror stories about all the new Springer M1As since they ran out of original milspec parts. Supposedly their new parts they make themselves are cheap cast pot metal junk... too bad really as I wanted to get a NM M1A, now I'm stuck looking for a used "preban" one that has good quality US MIL parts in it. It's a sad day when a Chinese Polytech M14 has better out of the box quality than an American made M1A.

You know, I had a similar problem with the new Springfield Armory M1 Garand I bought, as the barrel and trigger assembly were both made in Australia. Now, while I haven't had any problems with the trigger assembly, I did with the barrel, and it was out of warranty. So I bought a new barrel from Fulton Armory, which has proved to be a very reliable seller of all things AR and Garand related, and the fact they are located right here in Maryland made it even better for me. Now, they do make M14's, and from what I understand, all of their parts are made right here in the States or are new USGI parts. So why not try them out if you haven't already? Mind you, they can be a little pricey, but their quality is pretty good.

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My plans for an M1A have been (since I decided to pass on the new ones) sidetracked by my pending purchase of an FS2000 and possibly a PS90. Once those are in the collection then I might look back into one. I'm just not that large a fan of what I call "phone pole rifles". Things like the M1A, the Garand and others are all great rifles but to me they feel like I'm brandishing a phone pole. I prefer my rifles compact and easy to manuver.

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The shells get stuck in the chamber causing it to misfeed and it had a weak extractor and spring. I put a few hundred rounds though it with only a few malfunctions, but it wasn't kicking shells out hard. Then I replaced the extractor assembly with USGI. And it just got worse they stick in the chamber so tight you have ram then out.

I was over confident in SA's ability to put together a quality rifle. So the geniuses at SA repair just replace the extractor assembly and send it back. Eventually it'll work out, but for how much they cost it's way overpriced in terms of quality. I bet I have to send it back again.

Edited by R_Deckard

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The shells get stuck in the chamber causing it to misfeed and it had a weak extractor and spring. I put a few hundred rounds though it with only a few malfunctions, but it wasn't kicking shells out hard. Then I replaced the extractor assembly with USGI. And it just got worse they stick in the chamber so tight you have ram then out.

I was over confident in SA's ability to put together a quality rifle. So the geniuses at SA repair just replace the extractor assembly and send it back. Eventually it'll work out, but for how much they cost it's way overpriced in terms of quality. I bet I have to send it back again.

Have a chat with John Moe...he'll take care of you. If it's a warranty issue, they'll even refund shiping the cost to them.

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My plans for an M1A have been (since I decided to pass on the new ones) sidetracked by my pending purchase of an FS2000 and possibly a PS90. Once those are in the collection then I might look back into one. I'm just not that large a fan of what I call "phone pole rifles". Things like the M1A, the Garand and others are all great rifles but to me they feel like I'm brandishing a phone pole. I prefer my rifles compact and easy to manuver.

I was contemplating the FS2000 since it takes AR mags and I have a bunch...they're $1899 at CDNN right now...with the BLACK stock and not the green. ;)

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Has anyone here used or owned a FN Five-seven? I recently discovered that it's being sold for civilian use and is even legal to own in California, and was wondering how it handles, how robust it is, and how it stands up to the larger caliber name guns like H&K, Glock, Beretta, SIG...

I ask here, since researching keeps bringing me across Five-seven biased places, like the FN Five-seven forums, and I'd like some info from a less biased source.

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Not a fan of the caliber myself but it''s well made and dent for what it is. It's been somewhat thrust more into the limelight since they use it as a basis for the handguns on Battlestar Galactica since season 2.

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While I do not own one I have heard good things about them... from a target shooting standpoint.

As far as being useful as a civilian defensive handgun goes they are far underpowered, equating to about a .22 magnum in stopping power. The 5.7 round gets all it's "juice" from it's armor piercing capabilities. It was a purpose designed "jacket buster" round, when you remove it's AP properties for the civilian legal bullets you are left with pretty much a low power, low KE, low caliber bullet good only for varmit hunting or target shooting. Sure the weapons designed for it (FN Iom, PS90) can still take the LE Only AP ammo but... you as a civilian can't legally buy it or own it.

So I guess what I'm saying is is that the civilian ammo for the FN Iom is what really kneecaps it as a defensive handgun. If you are just buying it to plink cans or shoot targets I don't see how you can go wrong though. Just remember that it's a "designer caliber" and you are not going to be able to just walk down to the local Walmart and buy a box of 5.7 ammo. Expect to have to buy it online or special ordered through gunshops and the price will be a tad high for quite a while unless it somehow totally floods the market in the near future, which is highly unlikely.

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I've been learning a lot of stuff through this thread.

what's a good beginner shotgun to get? There's a Mossberg Maverick at the local Wal-mart for $160 or so.

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That's what I feared about the five-seven JsARCLIGHT, thanks for helping me on that. I kept reading rave stuff on it, but kept having big doubts about it due to the armor piercing capability taken out, and the bullet size. Plus it gets neutered to a ten round magazine in California.

And, yeah I was wondering from a self/home-defense standpoint on the five-seven.

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Yeah, the FN Iom is more of a collector's piece than it is a functional civilian defensive arm. If you already owned a bunch of pistols and rifles as I do and already had your one or two "go to" items for self defense if the need arised then buying something like the FN Iom to just plink around with or shoot targets would be fun. But if your primary need for a pistol is self defense then you might want to look into a good old .45 ACP. No need to buy a fancy pants piece like the FN. Go down to your local gun shop and handle some of the name brand .45 chambered pistols. For the same price as that FN you could get a nice 1911, SIG 220, a USP or a Glock 21 that will be cheaper to shoot and will stop a perp in his tracks if need be.

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some new pics of some of my new buys, and some of my old, long awaited stuff....

IPB Image

The RRA Tactical Entry. I have a Bushnell red dot i am gonna have mounted on it soon...

IPB Image

My two Enfields, A 1943 Faz No. 3 Mk. 1/2 and an 1911 Ishy No. 1 Mk. III

IPB Image

A clearer look at the barrels of the rifles.

IPB Image

My new 1916 P. 08. I couldn't get a clear enough pic of the Imperial Eagle (not the nazi cartouche) on The slide.

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It depends on what you are getting it for? A good home defense shotgun shares very little with a good sporting shotgun.

I guess I'd have to say for sporting use.

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.45 ACP!

Getting the job done since 1905! :ph34r:

IPB Image Can't go wrong there.

some new pics of some of my new buys, and some of my old, long awaited stuff....

Love the Enfields!

Edited by Gaijin

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I guess I'd have to say for sporting use.

OK, sporting use as in sporting clays, trap, skeet? Hunting? if so, hunting what? Are you looking for an auto, breach loader, pump? Lots of options to explore.

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OK, sporting use as in sporting clays, trap, skeet? Hunting? if so, hunting what? Are you looking for an auto, breach loader, pump? Lots of options to explore.

And what price range? Price range really helps dictate the action to look at as far as shotguns go. Pumps are by far the cheapest, with good over/unders being the most expensive, with semi-autos in the middle.

Of course, this is a broad generalization; there are inexpensive O/Us, and expensive semis.

If you're on a budget, I say get either a Remington 870 or a Mossberg 500. Try both; it's a real personal preference of one over the other for the most part (I myself prefer a 870 over a 500-series). Most people tend towards the 28" barrels, but I myself prefer the 26" - another personal preference. If you're getting the gun for sporting/hunting, you really don't want a barrel shorter than 26".

If you've got some more money to spend, try looking at the CZ-imported Huglu Over/Unders. I'm looking at picking up a "Redhead" in either 12 or 20 soon. Excellent guns for the price, but clearly cannot compete with the usual "good" over-unders (Beretta, Browning, etc - Huglus aren't anywhere near the price, though).

Also in the same price range as the Huglus ($600-$800), you could go with a Beretta or Remington gas-operated semi-auto. The decision of O/U vs. semi depends a lot on what exactly you want to do with it.

I personally favor the following shotguns:

Remington 870 (general-purpose)

Benelli autoloaders (sporting - currently use a Montefeltro, want a Sport II)

Blaser F3 (the king of all competition shotguns, IMO... too bad I can't afford one)

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You can't go wrong with an 870 for a first shotgun. I would go with a pump gun for the first one. Don't be fooled by the 870 "tactical models" out there right now, they are simply green Express models. The 870 Express models are still good guns, but they are different than the Express models of 10 years ago. The last Express I bought was in the early '90s.

If you want to kick it up a notch, you can spend more money for an 870 Police or maybe even a 590A1. I don't have a 590A1, but have always wanted one. I do have a 500 that is great, just not as smooth action as an 870.

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You can't go wrong with an 870 for a first shotgun. I would go with a pump gun for the first one. Don't be fooled by the 870 "tactical models" out there right now, they are simply green Express models. The 870 Express models are still good guns, but they are different than the Express models of 10 years ago. The last Express I bought was in the early '90s.

If you want to kick it up a notch, you can spend more money for an 870 Police or maybe even a 590A1. I don't have a 590A1, but have always wanted one. I do have a 500 that is great, just not as smooth action as an 870.

I had a 590. Great gun though a il long even with a folding Knoxx copstock. I sold it and plan on a 18" now.

Edited by Gaijin

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Having owned just about every type of modern pump shotgun at some point my personal favorite is still my old Ithaca 37 police model. I just like the old, smooth bottom action of that old shotty. But as far as parts availability and options the Mossy 500/590 and the Remmy 870 are the kings of the pile.

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Yeah, I'm going to stick to getting a .45 ACP for home/self-defense. My favorite pistol, until I shot a H&K USP45, was the 1911. So I'll probably go for a USP45 after all.

I've tried a Sig in .357sig, and it was super accurate, but I didn't like how it felt. I've tried a Beretta 92, but it handled like crap, felt like crap, and kept ejecting shells into my face for some reason. :p Left me with a bad impression of the Beretta line. I have yet to try a Glock. I've read and heard some bad stuff about Glock (like the higher caliber pistols blowing apart, especially the .45 ACP and .40s&w), so I'll be avoiding their pistols. I've talked with the guys at The Gun Store in Las Vegas, and was told that the Desert Eagle wasn't up for rental anymore because it couldn't handle constant use like the other famous pistols (so no Desert Eagle for me, not that I was seriously considering one).

Now if only CA didn't have that damned law that limits magazines to 10 rounds... :(

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As a Glock owner I can tell you that almost all of the stories you hear about Glocks "exploding", while true, are all caused by user error. Glocks have a special hexagonal rifled barrel that cannot handle open lead ammo. The lead builds up on the lands of the rifling and causes unsafe pressures in the chamber that in turn cause case failures... resulting in the gun blowing apart. Every single case of a Glock blowing up that I have seen has been predicated by either negligent use or bad ammo.

Then again ANY handgun or rifle can explode on you given the right circomstances... hence why you must keep your weapons clean and fully functional. Strip, clean and funciton check all your weapons before and after use to ensure you are opertating with safe hardware and only shoot manufacturer recommended ammo types.

Oh and BTW Desert Eagles are all bark... they are some of the lousiest handguns on the face of the earth. They will only run certain types of ammo, require meticulous cleaning and maintenance and even then STILL jam and misfeed regularly. I have a friend who owns two of them and he never shoots them because they are so finicky about operating. To this day I think he has only gone through about one magazine without some sort of stoppage. Now the Jericho, the small "Baby Desert Eagle", is based off of the CZ design and is a solid pistol.

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I noticed that in all the reference pics for the Glocks that blew, there was always a shell casing that blew out, which then blew the gun apart. On the subject of user error, I also saw a USP45 that was blown in half, because a guy used unknown brand ammo (that turned out to be over-packed or something like that). The hand grip was severed in two.

I had a close call with a sten gun, when a shell blew in the chamber. I pulled the trigger and the shell went KABOOM. Shrapnel went flying out the exit port, and I got some cuts on my arm and face (thank god for eye protection). Scared the crap out of me. It turned out that the portion of the shell that blew had a thinner wall than the rest of the shell. The gun had to go in for repairs of course.

I didn't know that the Desert Eagles were that bad. :p Dang, I should have started visiting this thread a long time ago, I keep learning new things. :)

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And I'll bet you a dollar that on all the pics of blown up Glocks you saw the case failure occured at the same spot on every one, which is six o'clock where the lip rests on the breach. Some models of Glock (mostly the .40 cal varients) have what is called an "unsupported chamber" there. What that means is that the chamber which holds the brass casing in place is relieved at the 6 o'clock position slightly to allow certain calibers of bullet to feed more reliably. And because of that relieved area the breach is "weak" there. You then have one set of people calling that a "design flaw" and "dangerous" and another set of people calling that "common" and "nothing to worry about". They are both right in a sense... a relieved breach at that position is quite common on modern self loading handguns that where designed for one caliber but later adapted to another (in the case of the Glock it was designed around the 9mm caliber and later retrofitted to run other cailbers) but at the same time you have to watch out for that, especially with the hexagonal rifling. You can't shoot open face lead bullets for risk of lead buildup.

Then again get a hot round or a weak case and no matter what kind of breach you have the thing will blow. You may take some brass or material from the pistol when it does so always wear eye protection (I learned that lesson the same way you did with a casing blowing up and spitting brass out the ejector).

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You definitely don't want an Eagle if you plan on shooting more than 50 rounds on each outing. Anyone that says Eagle's are perefectly reliable don't shoot it very often. Kinda like when I had the problems with my M1A, I posted it at Ar15.com and a bunch of people replied, mine's perfect, flawless I've put 300 rounds through it without a problem. I kept thinking mine was ok too for the first couple hundred rounds. Not to say there aren't current issue M1A's that do run fine, I'm sure there is.

On the Eagle I can speak from personal experience. I loved the way the gun looked and I kinda got persuaded by the hype , movies and all. I first bought a used MKVII. It had plenty of problems and I spent a fair amount of money trying to make it work. Eventually I wrote it off as a used gun problem and traded it for a brand new MKVII. That one ran good for a few months and I only used the ammo recomended by Magnum Research as I had been in contact with them fairly often trying to solve problems. Eventually I had to send it in for repair under the year warranty. Got it back same senerio. They seem to have different problems from gun to gun though. My last one's bolt guide pin would get warped causing the bolt to malfunction and misfeed. Basically the gun would shoot itself apart or to malfunction. Both of mine were .44 and it's just too much heat for a semi-auto.

On the flip side, when the Eagle did work it was amazing. When I got the new one I also got a spare 10" barrel and a 10 round .44 mag. That thing was F'in crazy looking like Robocop's gun. The best part was that it was an extremely accurate gun. When my new one was working right, with the 10" barrel I could put 10 rounds of .44 mag down range with just as much accuracy as my 1911 and in about the same amount of time. Much, much faster than a revolver. Once you get used to shooting it often the recoil is not that bad. I still think about getting one of the newer models in .357 in hope that it might be more reliable, but that's a dream.

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As a Glock owner I can tell you that almost all of the stories you hear about Glocks "exploding", while true, are all caused by user error. Glocks have a special hexagonal rifled barrel that cannot handle open lead ammo. The lead builds up on the lands of the rifling and causes unsafe pressures in the chamber that in turn cause case failures... resulting in the gun blowing apart. Every single case of a Glock blowing up that I have seen has been predicated by either negligent use or bad ammo.

Couldn't have worded that better myself. It's shocking how many people shoot leaded rounds in them and are surprised when they find out that it shouldn't be done.

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New Glocks are shipping with a sticker on the pistol now that says "NO LEAD BULLETS" or something to that effect on them. The problem is that most gun dealers remove that sticker and throw it away when they get the pistols in stock because it muddies up the look of the thing. My last two Glocks I bought factory new through my friend's FFL and got to open them both fresh and both pistols had that big yellow sticker on the grip.

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New Glocks are shipping with a sticker on the pistol now that says "NO LEAD BULLETS" or something to that effect on them. The problem is that most gun dealers remove that sticker and throw it away when they get the pistols in stock because it muddies up the look of the thing. My last two Glocks I bought factory new through my friend's FFL and got to open them both fresh and both pistols had that big yellow sticker on the grip.

Heck, even with the sticker, I'm sure there are people who will do it anyways. There is a dangerous amount of people out there who own guns and know very little or display an alarming lack of safety training. You should see some of the guns people turn in for safekeeping to us. :blink:

That said, there are a large number of sworn personnel that exhibit the same unfortunately. :(

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